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  1. #1
    BEB
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    Home defense - non firearm

    What would you advise for home defense for someone who doesn't want to bother with the responsibility and upkeep of a firearm? I'm not anti-gun at all - just exploring other options. I really hadn't given it much thought.

    There are always loose items to use as impromptu weapons if the need ever arises.

    Background - male, big enough guy I don't worry about those without weapons, no family to protect - completely self defensive.

  2. #2
    Aegis's Avatar
    Aegis is offline Master Officer
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    You might consider the TASER. They have a civilian version if I'm not mistaken. The TASER will only be effective against one assailant(if you hit).

    Actually a shotgun would probably be cheaper than a TASER. The shotgun is pretty easy to maintain and operate, and you don't have to be a sharpshooter to be effective with it.

    Just some things to consider.

  3. #3
    Pedro56's Avatar
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    just some alternates.

    This could never fail though

    http://www.lawenforcementforums.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic763_2.gif

    "I am the guy that keeps Mister Dead in his pocket." -'Mad' Max Rockatansky

    "An Englewood Ranger is no stranger to Danger.." -Unk

    Good Night Chesty Where Ever You Are.

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  4. #4
    Standard Dave's Avatar
    Standard Dave is offline Constable
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    You could look at preventing someone getting into your home in the first place which is the principle used in the UK where most people can't have a firearm that is avalible at very short notice for use.

    Consider locking doors and windows (used at all times) of high quality construction that are hard to force entry through.

    Anti climb paint, burglar spikes, lighting or CCTV as deterents.
    Things like these:-

    http://www.spikeandraise.co.za/index.htm

    http://www.starwalls.co.za/

    http://www.arj-security.co.uk/index.htm

  5. #5
    Growler's Avatar
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    Bat with nails. My mom is in her mid sixties and in NY and has a swing like Babe Ruth!!!
    Also look into what Aegis said. There really might be one.

  6. #6
    bird1's Avatar
    bird1 is offline Corporal
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro56 View Post

    This could never fail though

    nothing says lovin' like a good old fashion clubbin'
    " The hardest thing about disarming an armed suspect is not slipping on your own shit "

    Michael P. Gordon E.O.W 08 Aug 2004




    The opinions given in my posts DO NOT reflect the opinions, views, policies, and/or procedures of my employing agency. They are MY PERSONAL OPINIONS and I accept sole responsibility as such.

  7. #7
    HardNoseBull's Avatar
    HardNoseBull is offline HardNoseBull
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    Heres what I use. if they get past this and the wife then I'll shoot him
    Giggity giggity Goo!

    Glen Quagmire,Family Guy, Pick any Episode

  8. #8
    Ducky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro56 View Post



    just some alternates.

    Yep. Me likey. Swords are nice, too.
    \\
    ` ` ` ` < ` )___/\
    `` ` ` ` (3--(____)
    "...but to forget your duck, of course, means you're really screwed." - Gary Larson
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtN1YnoL46Q


  9. #9
    HardNoseBull's Avatar
    HardNoseBull is offline HardNoseBull
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    Here's option 2 at my house Odin chews on ya Cricket finishes ya off
    Giggity giggity Goo!

    Glen Quagmire,Family Guy, Pick any Episode

  10. #10
    Radar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Standard Dave View Post
    Wow! Those look nice!!!

    Although that website implies they are only available in South Africa.

    Maybe I should see what it takes to become a distributor here in the US.
    Here Speeder, Speeder, Speeder


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  11. #11
    Donut Aficionado's Avatar
    Donut Aficionado is offline The Hillbilly Warlord
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    I have found that a 120 pound pit-bull/bull mastif mix is a great home defense option. I wish I could upload a pic of Patton. He is what keeps my mind at ease while I am away.
    Insert witty comment and disclaimer here.

  12. #12
    BEK's Avatar
    BEK
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  13. #13
    armygrnt502's Avatar
    armygrnt502 is offline Making my streets safer, one day at a time
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    Bek, thats awesome...



    Always my fav...just in the intimidation factor alone. Seriously though, a decent shotty is easy to maintain and you dont need to be a dead eye to aim it. Hence the term scatter gun. That and the racking of a 12 guage is one of the most scary sounds that people hear and associate badness with..
    "Sometimes people need a little help. Sometimes people need to be forgiven. And sometimes they need to go to jail."


  14. #14
    BEB
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    Quote Originally Posted by Standard Dave View Post
    You could look at preventing someone getting into your home in the first place which is the principle used in the UK where most people can't have a firearm that is avalible at very short notice for use.

    Consider locking doors and windows (used at all times) of high quality construction that are hard to force entry through.
    Excellent point - as is I hardly ever use the deadbolt on the back door and there isn't one on the front. Fix the barn door before thinking of ways to catch the horses when they escape, eh? Really should replace the lockset in the front - there was a Stanley (junk) handle type there - locked myself out one day and ripped off the handle and used a stick to slide the bolt, only took a minute. Then I replaced it with something not much better

    Up until six months ago I had a great security system.



    Like I said, I hadn't really thought about it. People wouldn't get on the steps before my boy would let me know someone's coming. Since I don't have that time anymore I'm thinking through what to do now in case there ever is a problem.

    Flamethrower seems a little much, think I'll pick up a baseball bat.

  15. #15
    Piggybank Cop's Avatar
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    Mossberg 590 and 00 Buck.

    Clean and oil twice a year; change ammo once a year.

    If your ass ainít worth this much work put a neon sign up, easy pickings.

    A Doberman is also very handy, but you have to feel, care for, take to vet and love. (if not see above)

    Not trying to be a smart ass; just professional advice.

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  16. #16
    Iron Man's Avatar
    Iron Man is offline Don't Tase me bro!
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    +1 Get a Shotgun. Its not much to upkeep.

  17. #17
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    i keep my asp, by my bed, and my remington 870 in the corner by where i sleep. i pity whoever breaks in my house. slugs ftw!

  18. #18
    Coloradocop's Avatar
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    +5 or 6 here on the shotgun:

    Reasoning:

    -It is cheap to own and operate (you can buy a new Rem 870 home defense model for about $250 around here... and a box of slugs for under $5)

    -easy and intuitive to learn with

    -Very effective short range weapon (far better than any handgun)

    -The gun is also easy to maintain and clean

    -Regulations even in the more strict areas of the country usually don't make these guns hard to obtain.

    -won't require you to be a sharpshooter to get things done in the house (though let me point out here that the mainstream idea of it being a "scattergun" is a bit of an overstatement at home defense type distances --- If you shoot it on paper at a likely home defense distance, you'll probably only notice one somewhat large, somewhat oblong hole... not the "peppered" look people have come to expect from movies. Beyond ten to fifteen yards you'll start to see some noticeable spread with an open choke, but lets be realistic about home defense distances here... and realize that you still need to have some skill to be able to put lead on target)

    Still, in looking for "less-lethal" options... I might again echo the other posts here and encourage you to take a look at the civilian Taser. Tasers have their good and bad points, like anything else. When they work, they work great (my estimate is 80% of the time)... But if a probe misses the target, or the subject is extremely fat, or you don't get enough probe spread, you might just see a guy standing there who doesn't seem to care that you are Tasing him. I think the civilian version of the Taser goes for about $500, and cartridges (you get one shot per cartridge) run about $50. You'll also be buying an M26 equivalent for that price, not an X26 (this is the larger sized, "original" Taser... A lot of street officers today are carrying the X26's, which are far more compact).

    However, I have a few other reasons to discourage you from using a Taser. First, Tasers only disable for the time that they are actually sparking (and maybe a second or so afterwards). When the spark stops, the badguy can fight again. Of course, if the probes are still in, you can always light him up again. But, realize that we use this only until we can get said badguy into custody in the LE world... If you are trying to get badguy out of your house, this may not fit the bill (you can Tase him till the batteries are dead [about 3 minutes], and you can hope he runs away, but that may not solve your problem... unless you plan to cuff him yourself). For these reasons I think the Taser has severe limitations to the civilian user.

    You may also want to consider pepper spray, which has lasting effects for anywhere from 15-45 minutes (depending on individual sensitivity, type of spray, how much he was hit with, etc). This shit hurts like hell, and would likely get an attacker to run away or stop fighting in an ideal world (either of which I'm assuming you are seeking if you don't want to kill them). He'll hurt for a while, and won't be seeing too clearly.

    To recap:

    GUN: Ultimate (and final) solution. Solves the problem effectively, with user ability (and emotion) being the biggest limitations. My first choice for civilians.

    PEPPER: Hurts for a long time. Doesn't work well on everyone. My second choice for a civilian.

    TASER: Hurts more than pepper while operating, pain goes away real quick after the spark stops. Drops 80% or so of attackers hard, doesn't work out well about 20% of the time. My third choice for a civilian (despite the fact that it is one of my favorite on-duty less lethals).

    SPIKEY BASEBALL BAT PICTURED ABOVE: More therapeudic than a gun. Substitute for any of the above-listed options

    Hope all of this rambling nonsense helped!!!
    Last edited by Coloradocop; 12-10-06 at 03:38 AM.

  19. #19
    BEB
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    My main hesitation with a firearm is just that - hesitation. It's hard to envision realistic scenarios. It's easy to be talking about guns and say "yeah, I'd plug that SOB" but not having been there I'm not sure if would fire until it's too late. Swinging a club at someone is something anyone with cousins has done so it's then not a question of when, but how hard.

    On the other hand, in talking to someone about this they pointed out among people likely to break in the chances of them being armed goes way up. I dismissed it off hand, but I shouldn't have.

    TASER - just can't see it.

    Pepper - interesting. Need to research further - didn't know there were gels and such until I came here.

    The intimidation factor of a shotgun is something to keep in mind. I'm leaning more that way even though I was looking for non firearm ideas here. Currently I live in the city - not like there aren't avenues of retreat and hopefully a neighbor would let me use their phone so you guys could come by and catch the creep. That said, if someone breaks in with a gun, I'm not outrunning a bullet. Unlikely to ever happen, but that's what planning is for I suppose.

    --BEB

  20. #20
    Trojan 42's Avatar
    Trojan 42 is offline Retired Ninja
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    Don't forget you need room to swing a bat and that may not always be possible. And I'm glad you reconsidered my point about 'them' being armed in some way. Pump Action shotgun gets my vote too.
    To be born an Englishman, is to be a winner in the Lottery of Life.



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