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  1. #1
    spcwes's Avatar
    spcwes is offline Wookie!!!!
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    Thought Experiment: What gives you the right?

    Well using the same format as the FTL_Ian fella, I want to ask everyone, not just the civilians:

    What gives you the right? We have the US Constitution, that is an easy answer but in a world that wants everyone to change the US Constitution to suit the needs of the individual, what gives you the right?

    Do you know where your rights come from? Do you know them well enough to not have to be told?

    Do you think that the country as a whole should jump to change to every person's physical desire even when it has been proven to be bad for the person? Do you want that person making decisions for you or the nation as a whole?

    If this country is not being lead the way you want, what are the major changes that should be made overnight to make it all better?

    How do you feel about the Countries current religion practices and how should we do things differently to make it all better. I see this still as a major issue nation wide, what do you think?

    Cops, I have heard a few of you state that you feel CCW should never be and we are the only ones that should carry to make us safer. Explain your thoughts further, I would really like to hear how this all works.

    This is not a personal directed post, just a great conversation starter. Let's get it going!!

    One of the reasons I have started this thread is I have been playing a game for some time now by asking the folks I deal with to tell me rights when they get bent out of shape and imply I or other officers are violating their rights because a contact is not going as they had planned.

    There has not been one btw to even get a Constitutional right correct in support of what actions they may have been doing but a very large percentage feel that the Constitution should protect them and what ever they were doing no matter how retarded it might be so I want to hear some of your opinions.
    Last edited by spcwes; 12-29-06 at 02:01 AM.
    STOP RESISTING!!!!

    For he is God's servant to do you good, but if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword for nothing. He is God's servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer.

    The opinions expressed in this post are mine, and mine alone. They are NOT the opinions of my Agency or my Agency Heads.

  2. #2
    BEB
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    Quote Originally Posted by spcwes View Post
    What gives you the right? We have the US Constitution, that is an easy answer but in a world that wants everyone to change the US Constitution to suit the needs of the individual, what gives you the right?

    Do you know where your rights come from? Do you know them well enough to not have to be told?
    The constitution does not grant rights. Rather it articulates rights the government may not infringe. It is not a permission for people, it is a limit on government.

    Where those rights come from depends a bit on your view. The authors of the above document tended to give credit to the creator of the universe. Others like to speak of natural law. I'm not in the mood to stack angels on the head of a pin so moving on...

    Quote Originally Posted by spcwes View Post
    Do you think that the country as a whole should jump to change to every person's physical desire even when it has been proven to be bad for the person? Do you want that person making decisions for you or the nation as a whole?
    Skipping this for now.

    Quote Originally Posted by spcwes View Post
    If this country is not being lead the way you want, what are the major changes that should be made overnight to make it all better?
    If I had such a magic wand I'd wipe out a few billion pages of federal law and regulations based on the over leverage of the commerce clause. States have been weakened to the point they are little more than different colored areas on a map.

    Quote Originally Posted by spcwes View Post
    How do you feel about the Countries current religion practices and how should do things differently to make it all better. I see this still as a major issue nation wide, what do you think?
    Other than some annoying blue laws it's not something I give much thought to. The 10 Commandments marker in a city park is still there - doesn't bother me.

    Quote Originally Posted by spcwes View Post
    Cops, I have heard a few of you state that you feel CCW should never be and we are the only ones that should carry to make us safer. Explain your thoughts further, I would really like to hear how this all works.
    Curious to see the replies here. The state just passed a CCW law, but a local ordinance overrules it. The city council won't budge, and the local Police Chief is against it. The council members give reasons such as "we're safe" "the law is flawed and someone with a protection order could get a permit" "we don't need this" Usually they're not so dense.

    Quote Originally Posted by spcwes View Post
    One of the reasons I have started this thread is I have been playing a game for some time now by asking the folks I deal with to tell me rights when they get bent out of shape and imply I or other officers are violating their rights because a contact is not going as they had planned.

    There has not been one btw to even get a Constitutional right correct in support of what actions they may have been doing but a very large percentage feel that the Constitution should protect them and what ever they were doing no matter how retarded it might be so I want to hear some of your opinions.
    I'm surprised most people can figure out how to tie their shoes.
    And just in case anyone missed it - http://www.livescience.com/othernews...amendment.html

    Next?

    --BEB

  3. #3
    Watchman's Avatar
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    What gives you the right? We have the US Constitution, that is an easy answer but in a world that wants everyone to change the US Constitution to suit the needs of the individual, what gives you the right?
    As already stated,the Constitution does not grant rights nor does it claim to.

    Do you know where your rights come from? Do you know them well enough to not have to be told?
    My "rights" come from the Creator. I dont know where yours come from,nor do I care. Dont infringe upon mine, and I wont infringe upon yours. Thats easy enough to understand aint it?

    Do you think that the country as a whole should jump to change to every person's physical desire even when it has been proven to be bad for the person? Do you want that person making decisions for you or the nation as a whole?
    No. The problem is...the "country" dosent speak. What does speak is some primadonna that thinks his or her idea of existence is the best and wants everyone to do it their way and everyone else be damned.

    If this country is not being lead the way you want, what are the major changes that should be made overnight to make it all better?
    The first thing we could do is have term limits. Do a good job the first time and get re-elected. After that, you're out. The President has them, now we need to get those in socialist/marxist bastards that have been in Congress for 20+ years out of there because they are killing us.

    How do you feel about the Countries current religion practices and how should we do things differently to make it all better. I see this still as a major issue nation wide, what do you think?
    Its only been an issue in the last 30 or so years...when all children of all of the dope smokin hippies grew up and turned into liberals. It worked great for the other 200 and something years.

    Cops, I have heard a few of you state that you feel CCW should never be and we are the only ones that should carry to make us safer. Explain your thoughts further, I would really like to hear how this all works.
    You've never heard ME say that. I'm a CHL Instructor. I've taught classes to over 2 thousand people over the years. I have zero tolerance for people that are stupid enough to beleive that the cops will be there when they need them. I have even less tolerance for politicians that would rather have citizens be victims and knowing that thugs dont obey the law anyway. On second thought...if I were as sorry as MOST politicians...I wouldnt want ANYONE owning a gun...including my own mother.That way I could heap any amount of abuse I wanted to on the citizens without fear of getting whacked by someone I pissed off.

    This is not a personal directed post, just a great conversation starter. Let's get it going!!
    OK. I just did that...

    One of the reasons I have started this thread is I have been playing a game for some time now by asking the folks I deal with to tell me rights when they get bent out of shape and imply I or other officers are violating their rights because a contact is not going as they had planned.
    Its a fact...the folks that use the cops the most cant even SPELL Constitution...never mind understand it.

    There has not been one btw to even get a Constitutional right correct in support of what actions they may have been doing but a very large percentage feel that the Constitution should protect them and what ever they were doing no matter how retarded it might be so I want to hear some of your opinions.
    No suprise there. Educated folks dont need Police. Its the idiots and ingnorant folks that keep them all employed.

  4. #4
    zap's Avatar
    zap
    zap is offline yeahrightsurewhatever
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    Better judgement says to stay out of this....but what the hell....

    I have always, and will continue, to belived that God gave us the rights we have. The framers of the constitution simply understood and acknowledged that fact.

    ...where we get into trouble is that it is very hard for some people to accept God given rights...without believing in God in the first place.
    Stupidity Recognition Technician

  5. #5
    Willowdared's Avatar
    Willowdared is offline Bendy not Breaky
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    Free Will, Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness are G-d given.

    Everything else is up for negotiation.

    And I bolded "pursuit," because happiness of itself is not guarenteed, merely the pursuit of happiness.

    I believe that having chosen to belong to society, you enter into an unwritten contract with society to contribute towards it success, and participate in the day-to-day business that keeps it moving.

    Most of our laws came about because a select few refused to acknowledge the unwritten rules, and forced them to become codefied. Not always a bad thing, mind you, as society has sometimes been selective in who has been included in their ranks.
    Molly Weasley makes Chuck Norris eat his vegetables.

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  6. #6
    dadyswat's Avatar
    dadyswat is offline Officer First Class
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    The US Constitution grants limited powers to the Federal government and in theory the rest fell to the states. The Federal government has used the so called "commerce clause" to get their fingers into everything and have well overstepped the bounds that were given to them.

    As far a CCW goes, an armed populace are citizens and unarmed populace are subjects.

    End of subject.

  7. #7
    spcwes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman View Post
    As already stated,the Constitution does not grant rights nor does it claim to.
    As stated, most do not understand what the Constitution is for or stands for

    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman View Post
    My "rights" come from the Creator. I dont know where yours come from,nor do I care. Dont infringe upon mine, and I wont infringe upon yours. Thats easy enough to understand aint it?
    Well, the only issue I have with this statement is that if you are a crazy fuck that decides your rights come from the blue devil of Pluto and that includes the eating of babies, well that is not really a right.
    I do not agree that a person has the right to do what ever the fuck he/she wants to unless they live outside of society. Also, if you take a hard line and do not care then don't respond to the fucking post.

    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman View Post
    No. The problem is...the "country" dosent speak. What does speak is some primadonna that thinks his or her idea of existence is the best and wants everyone to do it their way and everyone else be damned.
    Not always, just when some folks don't get their way. Don't get me wrong, I am one of the folks that don't always get my way, but I deal with it and hope the vote for the primadonna turns out better next time as a whole. Because as a whole the country speaks through the primadonna's. Whether you like it or not, that is how it is.

    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman View Post
    The first thing we could do is have term limits. Do a good job the first time and get re-elected. After that, you're out. The President has them, now we need to get those in socialist/marxist bastards that have been in Congress for 20+ years out of there because they are killing us.
    No argument here. This is part of the problem, in a nut shell.

    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman View Post
    Its only been an issue in the last 30 or so years...when all children of all of the dope smoking hippies grew up and turned into liberals. It worked great for the other 200 and something years.
    SO TRUE!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman View Post
    You've never heard ME say that. I'm a CHL Instructor. I've taught classes to over 2 thousand people over the years. I have zero tolerance for people that are stupid enough to believe that the cops will be there when they need them. I have even less tolerance for politicians that would rather have citizens be victims and knowing that thugs don’t obey the law anyway. On second thought...if I were as sorry as MOST politicians...I wouldn’t want ANYONE owning a gun...including my own mother. That way I could heap any amount of abuse I wanted to on the citizens without fear of getting whacked by someone I pissed off.
    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman View Post
    Its a fact...the folks that use the cops the most cant even SPELL Constitution...never mind understand it.

    No surprise there. Educated folks don’t need Police. Its the idiots and ignorant folks that keep them all employed.
    These statements are hard for me to respond to as it seems as though you are insinuating that you have some type of facts to back this up with statistics and such. I have helped a many of folks out that had Masters and MD's and so on. I would think that by meaning educated you mean with schooling and they to call and use the police.

    Most of the stupid people that you are referring to are the ones that we deal with, not the ones that use the police. I hope you did not join a Law Enforcement forum in an attempt to bash cops. That would bring your stay here a bit short.
    STOP RESISTING!!!!

    For he is God's servant to do you good, but if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword for nothing. He is God's servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer.

    The opinions expressed in this post are mine, and mine alone. They are NOT the opinions of my Agency or my Agency Heads.

  8. #8
    Watchman's Avatar
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    These statements are hard for me to respond to as it seems as though you are insinuating that you have some type of facts to back this up with statistics and such. I have helped a many of folks out that had Masters and MD's and so on. I would think that by meaning educated you mean with schooling and they to call and use the police.
    No hard statistics, just my observations from most of the calls that we go out on. The average people around here live the lifestyle that dosent require a cop coming to their house a couple of times a week. They go to work everyday, are somewhat involved in the community and are not part of the problem.

    Most of the stupid people that you are referring to are the ones that we deal with, not the ones that use the police. I hope you did not join a Law Enforcement forum in an attempt to bash cops. That would bring your stay here a bit short.
    You misunderstand me. I LOVE cops and I have no intention of "bashing" them. I do see and realize that some of them dont care so much about "rights" and thats what keeps them in the source of many debates. I know they ALL arent like that...but its the minority of dicks in the profession that make it harder,sometimes much harder,for everyone else, and most departments problably have at least one.

    On the same hand are those that bitch about their rights being violated by the cops, but yet that cant really tell you what "rights" are being violated because they dont have a clue. That is what I am talking about. Ever heard the phrase " if you dont know your RIGHTS, you might as well not have any" ?

    That is so true.

    Feel better now?

  9. #9
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    Thought Experiment: What gives you the right?


    My ability and preparedness to kill in the defense of the afore mentioned.

    We are the thin blue line
    between you
    and all the money in the world.

    And no you can't have any.

 

 

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