View Poll Results: Would you rather...
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Do what's right and moral and lose your job
Do something immoral (but legal & authorized) and keep your job
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Thread: Moral Dilemma Question
04-05-08, 06:13 AM #1
Moral Dilemma Question
In any given instance, would you rather do what's right and moral, and lose your job, or do something immoral (but legal & authorized by a supervisor), and keep your job?
04-05-08, 06:17 AM #2Somebody Please, what the hell is that smell?
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is like an eggs-and-ham breakfast: the chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."
The views, opinions, stupid off the cuff comments, mouthy, obnoxious, thoughtless, etc etc etc are not always or even some of the time the belief of my department, so bugger off!
04-05-08, 06:24 AM #3Master OfficerVerified LEO
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04-05-08, 06:29 AM #4
I thought about this some and edited to add - This is an extremely hard question to answer. Yea, if I were single, just starting out I might buck the system a little more than now. Law enforcement is one of the few jobs around where you can get hired, gain experience, get some certificates under your belt, and go to another department only to start out at slightly more than rookie pay, and thats assuming you don't get blackballed when you are fired. That makes it hard to take a stand once you have been around a while. There is a line though that I am sure I would not cross. I am just glad that I have never been asked to cross that line.*************************"It wouldn't take much for me to up and run...to another life somewhere in the sun."*************************"There's something inherently wrong with having to put on a bullet-proof vest and a gun to go to work."-(An old friend)
Any statements or opinions given in my postings or profile do not reflect the opinions, views, policies, and/or procedures of my employer or anyone else other than me. They are my personal opinions or statements only, thereby releasing my employer , any other entity, or any other person of any liability or involvement in anything posted under the username "Cidp24" on O/R.
04-05-08, 08:31 AM #5
I'd probably keep my job.
But as has already been said, my decision would be based strongly on a case by case.No one has greater love than this, to lay down ones life for ones friends - John 15:13
"The Wicked Flee When No Man Pursueth: But The Righteous Are Bold As A Lion".
We lucky few, we band of brothers. For he who today sheds his blood with me shall be my brother.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~The opinions, beliefs, and ideas expressed in this post are mine, and mine alone. They are NOT the opinions, beliefs, ideas, or policies of my Agency, Police Chief, City Council, or any member of my department.
04-05-08, 08:38 AM #6
04-05-08, 08:57 AM #7
04-05-08, 10:28 AM #8
I would love to say that I would do the moral thing and yes under the right conditions most of us would, BUT anyone who has been in this line of work for any amount of time knows that sometimes we have to do things that we do not agree with and that may be morally wrong on some level.
I have found myself using the moral is different from criminal speech in domestic incidents quite often.
All of us have things that are hard line subject fore which we will not bend so each of us has to make those decisions for each case.
04-05-08, 10:43 AM #9RookieSupporting Member Lvl 3
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I have been there and done that and lost my job. It was and still is very devastating after many years. If you give up your integrity as an LEO you will lose the respect of everyone. It is a tuff road but life throws shit at you some time that you can't duck."A Knights Oath
A Knight is sworn to valor; His Heart only knows virtue; His Blade defends the helpless; His Might upholds the weak; His Words speak only the truth; His Wrath undoes the wicked"
Aspire to Inspire
04-05-08, 12:09 PM #10
I remind myself every day when I'm putting my shit on to go to work of my 2 goals: 1) go home at the end of my tour and 2) do what is right. And by "right", I don't necessarily mean in terms of "policy and procedure" or "what will get me noticed by my bosses" or "what will benefit me the most." If I lose my integrity, then what am I worth? I'm no better than the piece of shit turd I'm trying to lock up forever. I hold myself (and LEOs in general) to a much, much higher standard than I do the general public. I know it's tough, but I expect myself to be above reproach. If choosing what is right gets me bounced from the job, then so be it. There's a lot of things I can do for a living that will enable me to sleep at night with the peace of mind that I did what it right no matter what.
This being said, I'd like to have an actual example of the moral conundrum of what we're talking about.
04-05-08, 01:51 PM #11
As a matter of fact, we just had two Deputies 'Resign' yesterday... When the private forums are opened, I'll share with you all...
Basic gist... they did a medium screw up.. lied... were asked, lied... were shown video... lied... and er um.. resigned.. left the team room in t-shirts
CPT told us, if they had just come clean, he could have fixed it... Bye Bye...
04-05-08, 02:21 PM #12
Pleasing nobody, one person at a time.
That which does not kill me, better start fucking running.
If I lived every day like it was my last, the body count would be staggering.
I intend to go in harm's way. -John Paul Jones
Hunt the wolf, and bring light to the dark places that others fear to go. LT COL Dave Grossman
04-05-08, 04:29 PM #13
Good question. Courts have held that you can lie to a suspect about the crime you are investigating. Immoral, yes, Legal, yes. Ya do what ya gotta do, and you live with what you did. Lie to keep your job? Nope. Lie to a dirtbag, Yup. Lie under oath?? NEVER NEVER NEVER.
Remember back in the early 80s, vice was doing an undercover and a cadet was being used. This was oks by the Chief and all, no problemo. The cadet was picked up by a male of doubious character and taken to a remote parkinjg lot, where as cadet gave the code word. Communications stucked and the cadet was getting a hummer by the time his backup showed up. The Sgt told him not to tell the Judge he was getting blowed, just propositioned. The cadet told the truth and the case was thrown out. The cadet did the right thing. Nothhg happined to either the cadet or the Sgt, even after an internal investigation beause the "gentleman" made a complaint.
Moral of this story. Don't lie for no one.
04-05-08, 04:31 PM #14
I've made this decision before and came out ok, I'll do the right thing again, too.I'm your huckleberry...
Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!
You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.
I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
but every girl I found was either one way or the other...
04-05-08, 04:46 PM #15Rookie
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We have an election coming up and if the "wrong" one wins then I am sure that I will be faced with this issue and it may be an issue of doing or not doing something that may not be legal after seeing how this person did things when they held a former office. I will hate to lose my job after 24 years but I gotta stay on the side of whats legal.Stay safe, let's all go home.
04-05-08, 05:19 PM #16
04-05-08, 07:18 PM #17
Iam trying to think of a situation that something wrong is LEGAL and OK with the bosses but not good.
Getting a hummer on duty is illegal, testilying is ILLEGAL but lying to s suspect is ok and sometimes legal
What circumstances brought this on?
cant really answer but if its ok, and legal how can I lose my job.
Wait dont ask, sht happens all the time.A monday morning lunatic, disturbed from time to time. Temporary catatonic madman on occasion..
Lightning crashes a new mother cries, her placenta falls to the floor. The angel opens her eyes,the confusion sets in before the doctor can even close the door..
The views and comments of E-man are mine and mine alone and therefore might not reflect the views of others or people in my current department. As such since this is still America I can post what I want without fear of retribution. I think.
04-05-08, 07:43 PM #18
I clicked on the wrong choice in my vote....sorry. I try to look out for me and mine in this world. However, I can't look myself or my family in the eye when I come home what does it matter. I became a leo to try to add just an ounce of justice to this world when I got the chance. My priorities are God, Family, and Country in that order. Immoral activity offends my God and my Family. I serve one and Lead the other. Coming up short in either task is unacceptable to me or my very being. The fact that you are being faced with this decision should be considered a red flag Brad. This is especially true in our line of work. Romans 13:1-5 is not in my signature because I think it sounds cool. It is there because without I could not endure the trials that this calling presents. Call this post cheesy or whatever you want. It means this much to me because it is the essence of why I do this job. This is a heart to heart subject and you got a heart to heart answer.
Meanwhile, fishing in Russia:
"When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." -- Frederic Bastiat
"Certainly there is no hunting like the hunting of man and those who have hunted armed men long enough and liked it, never really care for anything else thereafter." Ernest Hemingway
The opinions given in my signatures & threads DO NOT reflect the opinions, views, policies, and/or procedures of my employing agency. They are my personal opinions only, thereby releasing my agency of any liability, or involvement in anything posted under the username "Five-0" on Officerresource.com
04-05-08, 08:02 PM #19
My theory is that although this job is a calling of sorts for most of us that work it..it is still just that...a job. Sometimes the only thing we truly hold for ourselves is the morals and truths we hold. Would it sadden me to lose this job..yes. But I would rather be unemployed and be able to look at myself in the morning without regrets knowing that I kept my sense of honor by doing what is right.Never be afraid to do what's right, especially if the well-being of a person or animal is at stake. Society's punishments are small compared to the wounds we inflict on our soul when we look the other way" ~Martin Luther King, Jr
04-05-08, 08:06 PM #20
It is a strong moral compass which draws me to this job. I will cling to it, and with faith do that which it commands far above any order given me by man alone.
"The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money."
- Alexis de Tocqueville, Democracy in America
Tell me not, Sweet, I am unkind,
That from the nunnery
Of thy chaste breast and quiet mind
To war and arms I fly. - Lovelace
The opinions expressed by this poster are wholly his own, and should never be construed to even remotely be in representation of his employer, its agencies or assigns. In fact, they probably fail to be in alignment with the opinions of any rational human being.
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