Welcome to the APBWeb.

View Poll Results: Do you support Open Carry in CA?

Voters
30. You may not vote on this poll
  • NO!... I think it's a terrible idea.

    16 53.33%
  • YES!.. I think it's your right to do so if you choose.

    14 46.67%
Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 65
  1. #41
    MacLean's Avatar
    MacLean is offline O/R Gun mod
    Verified LEO
    Super Moderator
    Join Date
    09-05-07
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    11,805
    Rep Power
    4604045
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigdaddy1 View Post
    How would society take your safety and security more seriously? What should we (law abiding civilians) do to aid you in your protection? Keep in mind this is not a snide comment, but a real question. Society views you (police) as the protectors, not those in need of protection
    I actually understand the point here, but it gets confusing unless you recognize the initial comment about protection had to do with not having license plates that scream cop.

    I don't believe anyone here is asking for any special protection, but rather folks were lamenting the fact that it is dangerous for us to show professional pride outside the work place.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  2. #42
    WS6 Rampage is offline Rookie
    Join Date
    03-12-11
    Posts
    10
    Rep Power
    0
    Not to be rude or disrespectful to anyone, but I do believe that this threads topic digressed pretty far from Open Cary in CA. ...Just saying!

  3. #43
    Sarge405's Avatar
    Sarge405 is offline Sergeant
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    09-22-10
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    116
    Rep Power
    181625
    Been around the block a few times and seen a little. Don't live in Ca. but in a state with OC&CC. My opinions-

    I am a lifetime NRA member. Support every law-abiding citizens right to carry and defend themselves and their families.

    I support concealed carry "shall issue on demand" to law abiding citizens. I do not support open carry. Here's why. We have enough to do without answering another thousand calls from hysterical citizens seeing a "person with gun" . Of course we divert resources from other major calls to go on these.
    In my opinion, anyone openly carrying has some sort of power issues. I am a police officer and I would NOT even consider doing it for my own safety. I see detectives, off-duty officers doing and shake my head in disgust. When not in uniform my weapon and badge are concealed. I will not make a target of myself off duty nor should a civilian.
    "Weakness of attitude becomes weakness of character."
    Albert Einstein

  4. #44
    WS6 Rampage is offline Rookie
    Join Date
    03-12-11
    Posts
    10
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Sarge405 View Post
    Been around the block a few times and seen a little. Don't live in Ca. but in a state with OC&CC. My opinions-

    I am a lifetime NRA member. Support every law-abiding citizens right to carry and defend themselves and their families.

    I support concealed carry "shall issue on demand" to law abiding citizens. I do not support open carry. Here's why. We have enough to do without answering another thousand calls from hysterical citizens seeing a "person with gun" . Of course we divert resources from other major calls to go on these.
    In my opinion, anyone openly carrying has some sort of power issues. I am a police officer and I would NOT even consider doing it for my own safety. I see detectives, off-duty officers doing and shake my head in disgust. When not in uniform my weapon and badge are concealed. I will not make a target of myself off duty nor should a civilian.
    I see your point. ... BUT... Unfortunately, I'm not fortunate enough to live in a "Pro-Gun" state that SHALL-ISSUE UPON REQUEST. If it was, I'd be CC all day and would gladly refrain from "advertising.".... For me, its not a "power issue" over others but rather self-empowerment. It's not me saying "I want to make people freak out and or stare". It's really more like "I'm have an American right to defend myself this way BUT because I live in CA and state officials here want me to scare you by forcing me to OC. Say hello to another Anti-gun citizen! When's election day? -Cheers!"...

    It's a pain. ... It's California. ... Its pathetic

    Either way, if your an LEO, I respect your point of view. I can only assume the frustration felt when you have to answer a "man w/ a gun" call only to find out it's an OC situation. It's frustrating for those of us who would have to stand there for the "12031 Check" and keep legal phrases in mind just in case, hit the record button on our digital recorders or iPhones (also, just in case)... all while remembering to stand still and not move a muscle. So the frustration is felt on both sides. Haha!! -Cheers!!

  5. #45
    Sarge405's Avatar
    Sarge405 is offline Sergeant
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    09-22-10
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    116
    Rep Power
    181625
    WS6
    I respect your opinion and the only option afforded you and why you have to take advantage of it. I can only give my opinions. When I respond to a "person with gun" call, you have to understand the why's of my mistrust. I do not know you are a law abiding citizen. I do not know what the circumstance are. My call may only be a suspicious person with a gun. No further information available. Are you in fact a criminal whose weapon "flashed" and someone saw it" .

    Just like a traffic stop with a concealed carry holder that flashes when I call in the plates. Its for the registered owned. Is that the driver? Was the gun in the car and the car stolen but not reported yet? Any number of circumstances can be stumbled upon in our line of work. The interaction between us and the firearm carrier always has to start off with us treating every situation the same until we are satisfied that you pose no threat to us or the citizenry at large.

    That initial encounter is what I find disturbs most honest open and concealed carriers. For some reason, and this is my opinion based on my interactions, they feel their 2nd Amend. rights trump everything. I have heard the JackBoot thug argument to I have no constitutional authority to stop them. For some reason I have become the enemy. This I do not understand. Concealed carry is the only way to alleviate the problem of public hysteria, which will always be there. People will always be afraid of guns. Law abiding gun owners need to stop being part of the silent majority and organize in order to elect politicians sympathetic to concealed carry legislation.
    "Weakness of attitude becomes weakness of character."
    Albert Einstein

  6. #46
    ChesCopPodz's Avatar
    ChesCopPodz is offline Wandering son
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    12-04-05
    Location
    In the shadow of the Rockies
    Posts
    1,303
    Rep Power
    2187919
    I see your point. ... BUT... Unfortunately, I'm not fortunate enough to live in a "Pro-Gun" state that SHALL-ISSUE UPON REQUEST. If it was, I'd be CC all day and would gladly refrain from "advertising.".... For me, its not a "power issue" over others but rather self-empowerment. It's not me saying "I want to make people freak out and or stare". It's really more like "I'm have an American right to defend myself this way BUT because I live in CA and state officials here want me to scare you by forcing me to OC. Say hello to another Anti-gun citizen! When's election day? -Cheers!"...
    This makes sense to me. If open carry is the only way you can defend yourself, than that's what you should do........with a loaded gun. I see zero good things about openly carrying an unloaded gun. You can't even defend yourself unless you have the advantage of enough time to load it up first.
    The world would be much cleaner if blind people carried brooms instead of sticks.

    At communion, when the priest says "Body of Christ", I say "Thanks, I've been working out", then I grab the cracker and run back to my seat

    An amateur practices until he gets it right. A professional practices until he cant get it wrong.

    They've got us surrounded? Good. Now we can fire in any direction. Those bastards won't get away this time.

  7. #47
    MacLean's Avatar
    MacLean is offline O/R Gun mod
    Verified LEO
    Super Moderator
    Join Date
    09-05-07
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    11,805
    Rep Power
    4604045
    Quote Originally Posted by ChesCopPodz View Post
    This makes sense to me. If open carry is the only way you can defend yourself, than that's what you should do........with a loaded gun. I see zero good things about openly carrying an unloaded gun. You can't even defend yourself unless you have the advantage of enough time to load it up first.

    CA requires they carry their gun unloaded.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  8. #48
    pgg's Avatar
    pgg
    pgg is online now Damnit, I'm hungry again.
    Verified LEO
    Super Moderator
    Join Date
    06-16-08
    Location
    Fled the Emerald Triangle
    Posts
    11,000
    Rep Power
    4046225
    Quote Originally Posted by MacLean View Post
    CA requires they carry their gun unloaded.
    And it allows officers to check and verify that it is unloaded. Keep in mind that you still can't open carry in a school zone in CA
    'Political Correctness is a doctrine fostered by a
    delusional, illogical liberal minority, and rabidly
    promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which
    holds forth the proposition that it is entirely
    possible to pick up a turd by the clean end!'

    A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity. Sigmund Freud

  9. #49
    WS6 Rampage is offline Rookie
    Join Date
    03-12-11
    Posts
    10
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Sarge405 View Post
    WS6
    I respect your opinion and the only option afforded you and why you have to take advantage of it. I can only give my opinions. When I respond to a "person with gun" call, you have to understand the why's of my mistrust. I do not know you are a law abiding citizen. I do not know what the circumstance are. My call may only be a suspicious person with a gun. No further information available. Are you in fact a criminal whose weapon "flashed" and someone saw it" .

    Just like a traffic stop with a concealed carry holder that flashes when I call in the plates. Its for the registered owned. Is that the driver? Was the gun in the car and the car stolen but not reported yet? Any number of circumstances can be stumbled upon in our line of work. The interaction between us and the firearm carrier always has to start off with us treating every situation the same until we are satisfied that you pose no threat to us or the citizenry at large.

    That initial encounter is what I find disturbs most honest open and concealed carriers. For some reason, and this is my opinion based on my interactions, they feel their 2nd Amend. rights trump everything. I have heard the JackBoot thug argument to I have no constitutional authority to stop them. For some reason I have become the enemy. This I do not understand. Concealed carry is the only way to alleviate the problem of public hysteria, which will always be there. People will always be afraid of guns. Law abiding gun owners need to stop being part of the silent majority and organize in order to elect politicians sympathetic to concealed carry legislation.
    Oh, I understand completely what your saying! ... If I was an LEO, id be super suspicious of an OC also. It's your job and who in your line of work wants to be an unfortunate statistic! ...

    Yea, I know the type of OCs your referring to. Haha! Those are the ones that make us ALL look like jerks! ... It's generally understood, that's your job as an LEO to check for an unloaded weapon. I heard a few say that "We need to educate the police!"... Great way to get the LEOs on our side, let's give them attitude! That'll work wonders!! **head shaking** LOL!!.. ... I've always viewed it like this, if and when I receive a 12031 check, comply with the LEO, show him or her the respect they deserve, don't argue a damn thing and the respect will be equally returned. It'll be over with as quick as it began.

    Truthfully though, I recently just stopped OC. Reason being that I'm currently attempting to join LAPD. I have no desire to have my name pop up on a report or something at the moment that puts me in a negative light while going through the process. Too important for me to risk at the moment. ... I WISH I had a CCW!

  10. #50
    WS6 Rampage is offline Rookie
    Join Date
    03-12-11
    Posts
    10
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by MacLean View Post
    CA requires they carry their gun unloaded.
    Look, but don't touch. Touch, but don't taste. Taste, but don't swallow. ...Carry, but don't load. Haha!!

  11. #51
    Sarge405's Avatar
    Sarge405 is offline Sergeant
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    09-22-10
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    116
    Rep Power
    181625
    Quote Originally Posted by WS6 Rampage View Post
    Truthfully though, I recently just stopped OC. Reason being that I'm currently attempting to join LAPD. I have no desire to have my name pop up on a report or something at the moment that puts me in a negative light while going through the process. Too important for me to risk at the moment. ... I WISH I had a CCW!
    I want to wish you the best of luck. You seem to have a level head about you and a good common sense.
    "Weakness of attitude becomes weakness of character."
    Albert Einstein

  12. #52
    lewisipso's Avatar
    lewisipso is offline Injustice/Indifference/In God we trust
    Supporting Member Lvl 3
    Verified LEO
    Super Moderator
    Join Date
    02-02-07
    Location
    Louisiana
    Posts
    14,725
    Rep Power
    6962511
    Quote Originally Posted by WS6 Rampage View Post
    Truthfully though, I recently just stopped OC. Reason being that I'm currently attempting to join LAPD.
    Hate that you had to give up your only option but good fortune in your endeavor.
    Do not war for peace. If you must war, war for justice. For without justice there is no peace. -me

    We are who we choose to be.

    R.I.P. Arielle. 08/20/2010-09/16/2012


  13. #53
    MacLean's Avatar
    MacLean is offline O/R Gun mod
    Verified LEO
    Super Moderator
    Join Date
    09-05-07
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    11,805
    Rep Power
    4604045
    Quote Originally Posted by pgg View Post
    And it allows officers to check and verify that it is unloaded. Keep in mind that you still can't open carry in a school zone in CA

    As serious a constitutional challenge waiting as I have ever seen.

    Any law that *allows* a search affirmatively is asking to be shot down.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  14. #54
    121Traffic's Avatar
    121Traffic is offline Just Us
    Verified LEO
    Site Moderator
    Join Date
    01-09-06
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    4,547
    Rep Power
    6332993
    Quote Originally Posted by MacLean View Post
    As serious a constitutional challenge waiting as I have ever seen.

    Any law that *allows* a search affirmatively is asking to be shot down.
    You know, when I was a newer cop, I would have wholeheartedly supported the law as described.

    People think that cops like to trample on constitutional rights. The longer I do this work, the more I VALUE constitutional rights. Most especially my own. And now that I've been through some ridiculous trials and tribulations when it comes to acquiring firearms, both as a law abiding citizen and as a gainfully employed cop, I'm a huge proponent of leaving citizens with guns alone unless there's a lawful reason not to.

    Unless I have RAS to contact someone for a crime, and can then articulate a terry pat based on the presence of the gun, I have a huge problem with a law that allows cops to stop a citizen based solely on possession of a visible firearm, absent ANY other justification, just to verify it is unloaded.
    "If anything worthwhile comes of this tragedy, it should be the realization by every citizen that often the only thing that stands between them and losing everything they hold dear... is the man wearing a badge." -- Ronald Reagan, in the wake of the deaths of 4 CHP troopers in the Newhall Incident, 1970

    The opinions given in my posts DO NOT reflect the opinions, views, policies, and/or procedures of my employing agency. They are my personal opinions only, thereby releasing my agency of any liability, or involvement in anything posted under the username "121Traffic" on O/R.

  15. #55
    pgg's Avatar
    pgg
    pgg is online now Damnit, I'm hungry again.
    Verified LEO
    Super Moderator
    Join Date
    06-16-08
    Location
    Fled the Emerald Triangle
    Posts
    11,000
    Rep Power
    4046225
    Unfortunately so far the courts have upheld it. It is in the 9th circus though.
    'Political Correctness is a doctrine fostered by a
    delusional, illogical liberal minority, and rabidly
    promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which
    holds forth the proposition that it is entirely
    possible to pick up a turd by the clean end!'

    A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity. Sigmund Freud

  16. #56
    MacLean's Avatar
    MacLean is offline O/R Gun mod
    Verified LEO
    Super Moderator
    Join Date
    09-05-07
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    11,805
    Rep Power
    4604045
    Quote Originally Posted by pgg View Post
    Unfortunately so far the courts have upheld it. It is in the 9th circus though.
    No Federal court has upheld that, and I'd be surprised even if the 9th did - although they get shot down by SCOTUS so often it's a wonder they show up.

    However, let's take that argument....

    The court says it is ok in California.

    Doesn't mean *I* do it.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  17. #57
    sgtbear111's Avatar
    sgtbear111 is offline retired
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    02-23-07
    Location
    Eastern Washington
    Posts
    1,096
    Rep Power
    1013301
    Quote Originally Posted by 121Traffic View Post
    You know, when I was a newer cop, I would have wholeheartedly supported the law as described.

    People think that cops like to trample on constitutional rights. The longer I do this work, the more I VALUE constitutional rights. Most especially my own. And now that I've been through some ridiculous trials and tribulations when it comes to acquiring firearms, both as a law abiding citizen and as a gainfully employed cop, I'm a huge proponent of leaving citizens with guns alone unless there's a lawful reason not to.

    Unless I have RAS to contact someone for a crime, and can then articulate a terry pat based on the presence of the gun, I have a huge problem with a law that allows cops to stop a citizen based solely on possession of a visible firearm, absent ANY other justification, just to verify it is unloaded.
    -----------------------------------------------------
    +1 and amen.

    The time spent between the academy and retirement can be looked upon as a mixed lesson in civics,, constitutional law and addiction to power. The problem with the party line legislature and single source elected officials is: they become arrogant, unaccountable; they obey their Party masters and have lost the ability to think, and respect the rights of others.
    Some people come into our lives and quickly go. Some stay for awhile and leave footprints on our hearts. And we are never, ever the same.-- Anonymous

    Old People, like me, may not be around to witness the destruction of our Nation. The rest of you may not survive the collapse. We all have the sworn duty to prevent it.

    The light of hope burns brighter than the fires of doom.

  18. #58
    serpico155 is offline Rookie
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    07-12-10
    Location
    illinois
    Posts
    19
    Rep Power
    0
    on the matter of having lic.plates\that say f.o.p on them ...ive had
    lic.plate brackets for yrs with f.o.p active member on them and nver had a problem ..ive had problems with having my squad car parked in my driveway ..but never the plates ..ill get them when there avaliable and proudly display them on the car that i drive only .. ihave never lived in fear or plan to now th at im retired . because after..being amarine in a grunt company in vietnam in 1969 ..and after recieving 2 purple hearts ..im a firm believer when it your time to go therers nothing you can do or say to stop it ...ive seen to many times in my life tro believe it any other way

  19. #59
    MacLean's Avatar
    MacLean is offline O/R Gun mod
    Verified LEO
    Super Moderator
    Join Date
    09-05-07
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    11,805
    Rep Power
    4604045
    Quote Originally Posted by serpico155 View Post
    on the matter of having lic.plates\that say f.o.p on them ...ive had
    lic.plate brackets for yrs with f.o.p active member on them and nver had a problem ..ive had problems with having my squad car parked in my driveway ..but never the plates ..ill get them when there avaliable and proudly display them on the car that i drive only .. ihave never lived in fear or plan to now th at im retired . because after..being amarine in a grunt company in vietnam in 1969 ..and after recieving 2 purple hearts ..im a firm believer when it your time to go therers nothing you can do or say to stop it ...ive seen to many times in my life tro believe it any other way
    I'm guessing your perspective changes as you get older, having survived Vietnam.

    Thank you for that service!
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  20. #60
    HudsonHawk's Avatar
    HudsonHawk is offline Moderator
    Premium Lifetime Member
    Verified LEO
    Site Moderator
    Join Date
    01-17-06
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    2,537
    Rep Power
    1710442
    Quote Originally Posted by WS6 Rampage View Post
    I see your point. ... BUT... Unfortunately, I'm not fortunate enough to live in a "Pro-Gun" state that SHALL-ISSUE UPON REQUEST. If it was, I'd be CC all day and would gladly refrain from "advertising.".... For me, its not a "power issue" over others but rather self-empowerment. It's not me saying "I want to make people freak out and or stare". It's really more like "I'm have an American right to defend myself this way BUT because I live in CA and state officials here want me to scare you by forcing me to OC. Say hello to another Anti-gun citizen! When's election day? -Cheers!"...

    It's a pain. ... It's California. ... Its pathetic
    If law prohibits you from carrying any other way, then by all means it is your RIGHT to carry in that manner if you choose to do so. I don't that OC is a good idea, tactically, especially unloaded.

    Here's a fairly recent article where an OC'er was attacked and had his loaded gun taken away. Luckily the pistol was secured by a witness. Customer attacked at Garcia's restaurant | KOB.com
    "never bring paws to a gunfight" - Jenna

 

 
Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •