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  1. #21
    Retdetsgt's Avatar
    Retdetsgt is offline How did I get here!
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris2001
    But if you have done nothing wrong and know it, there is nothing to worry about.
    That's true most of the time, but not always. I have seen people hung out to dry because of political correctness violations and a few just because someone wanted to set an example. It's better than a crap shoot, but just like in the real criminal justice system, everyonce in a while somebody gets hung that didn't deserve it.
    When I used to be somebody (I'm center top)

    "A burning desire for social justice is never a substitute for knowing what you're talking about". -Thomas Sowell-

  2. #22
    StanSwitek's Avatar
    StanSwitek is offline Corporal
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    I call it getting called in on the carpet. My department is usually very fair on these investigations. Most of the time they go out of the way to exonerate an innocent officer. We have people complain all the time & say they will drop their complaint if the department drops the criminal charges against them. Not a chance with my department. IA has no say in criminal cases on my department, not even against the officers. If it does appear there was criminal conduct by an officer after the IA case is over it is farmed out to the appropriate investigative detail. 95% of the compalints my department gets are BS but they are still investigated thoroughly. many of the remaining 5% do not rise to the level of misconduct. My department is not shy about filing a criminal case against those who knowingly make a false cae against an officer.
    IA does not make a recommendation on disposition or discipline. That is the decision of the chief of police.
    Last edited by StanSwitek; 12-27-05 at 03:07 PM.

  3. #23
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    StanSwitek is offline Corporal
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    Quote Originally Posted by Retdetsgt
    That's true most of the time, but not always. I have seen people hung out to dry because of political correctness violations and a few just because someone wanted to set an example. It's better than a crap shoot, but just like in the real criminal justice system, everyonce in a while somebody gets hung that didn't deserve it.
    I agree. Sometimes just doing nothing wrong is not enough. I know exactly what you are talking about..

    I'll give you an example. We had a deal where a prisoner was very combative in the field. There was an appropriate & in policy use of force. At the jail, the suspect refused to exit the car & kicked at officers. Baton strikes to fend off the kicks would have been appropriate but no one struck the crook. They officers had their tape recorder on recording the incident. One of the officer present, unknown who, stated "stop kicking or you will get your ass kicked again." The suspect complied. No more force was necessary. It was never determined who made this statement. In reviewing the case, the deputy chief wanted to hammer the officer who made the statement. In fact, an officer who was present but never identified as making the statement received a letter of reprimand on the "inherent liklihood" he made the statement. Why? Because the DC disliked the officer. The reprimand was later overturned.

  4. #24
    Luvmcl is offline Member
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    Our agency is large enough to have two full time supervisors staffed in the Professional Standards Unit.

    I think our policy is one the fairest I've ever seen.

    As detectives in the PSU, we are simply fact finders. We do not make any recommendations regarding case disposition or potential discipline. As a matter of fact, we strive to remain as objective as possible and simply document findings based on items of evidentiary value.

    Our report is then submitted up the chain and the Sheriff makes the final determination on a list of options provided as Sustained, Non-Sustained, Exonerated, Unfounded or Policy Failure.

    If the charges are found as Sustained, then the entire package goes to a Disciplinary Review Board.

    The Principal (charged employee) is allowed to select one peer to sit on the DRB. There is a representative from the Deputies Association who sits on the DRB, another peer selected by a command officer, a first line supervisor of higher rank than the Principal and a Command Officer.

    The DRB makes a recommendation on discipline and sends it back up the chain to the Sheriff. The Sheriff has final authority on discipline.

    I have been in the unit for nearly a year now and you might be amazed to find out what the trend has been.

    The majority of the time, the DRB makes stiffer discipline recommendations than the Sheriff agrees with. One of the last ones I worked on the Sheriff gave the Principal one day off without pay, but the DRB had recommended demotion and an 80 hour suspension without pay.

    This policy really takes a lot of the old school IA heat off us in PS as they know we are only fact finders.

    We still get teased on occasion, stuff like, “Shut up, IA is here.” But, the guys always stop in to say hey, or joke around with us. (And……..the last range, me and my partner scored higher than the majority of Patrol, they didn’t like that much. )

  5. #25
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    danninator is offline po-leece
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    My department doesn't have an IA just the higher ups look into "matters." I got jammed up with some stupid shit(seriously stupid) because of an idiot partner who I was immediately associated with. The Sgt. of the squad that was on plus my desk sgt. went to bat for me, lieutenant sat down and listened to my side and apologized for the mix up. Offending partner was merely moved to nights for a few months with no record of what happened. Obviously I can't speak for the larger departments but in the smaller ones (mine is 45 fulltimers and about 30 part-timers) we are close and will stick up for each other, and the white shirts will work hard for us just as we do for them. No fear of any IA crap.
    No life 'til leather gunna kick some ass tonight.

  6. #26
    Luvmcl is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by danninator
    No fear of any IA crap.
    Same on my department, except when the Principal knows they stepped on their dick big time.

    A few of our investigations revealed some asinine conduct, Jerry Springer stuff, and nobody is going to back those fools. Not even the most hard core street warriors.

  7. #27
    Retdetsgt's Avatar
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    Now I think we have about 8, maybe 10 Sgts assigned to IA. When it first started up, it was kinda shaky.

    I got called in for kneeing a guy in the junk when I was putting him in the car, handcuffed.

    A couple of funny things happened right off. First, the investigating Sgt was one of my FTO's and one of the most brutal blackgloved pricks I've ever worked with. We started off the interview with my reminding him of some of the things I'd seen him do, complete with places, dates and times.... I'll get into that later.

    I asked him right off if the suspect was the complainant. I'd arrested this guy a several times before and it didn't make sense he'd whine. He told me that no, it was some citizen driving by. I asked if he'd talked to "Jamie" the suspect yet and he replied he hadn't. Some investigator!

    I pulled out my notebook, asked to use his phone and called Jaime up at home. It was before noon so I knew he'd still be in bed. I told Jaime that some guy had complained on me for kicking him in the nuts and the investigator wanted to talk to him. I handed the phone to the investigator.

    I could tell that Jaime was reading him the riot act. After he hung up, he told me that Jaime said that I had kicked him in the nuts, but he was "out of pocket" and deserved it. He told the Sgt that he was kicking at me (he was) and I had ever reason to do that. If he wanted to bitch me off, he'd do and didn't need some pencil neck doing it for him. Case closed....

    Back to the notebook. When I was brand new, an old cop told me to always carry an extra notebook and every time you saw some other cop do something that wasn't right, write it down, place, time, date and description. You never know when it might blow up or they might be promoted and try to do you sometime. It's nice to have a little insurance in your pocket.....

    In all fairness, that was when IA was new and they were putting in people who were freshly promoted. Now they look for people with detective experience. It's much, much better now.
    When I used to be somebody (I'm center top)

    "A burning desire for social justice is never a substitute for knowing what you're talking about". -Thomas Sowell-

  8. #28
    lesta311's Avatar
    lesta311 is offline Evil is my business.......
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    BTW, I refer to it as a "Walk on the carpet" because our IA is located on the 5th floor of Headquarters where the chiefs office is located. All the other floors are tile except that one. That's what makes it special.

 

 
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