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  1. #1
    121Traffic's Avatar
    121Traffic is offline Just Us
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    NFA Firearms and Gun trusts?

    Any one here with NFA Firearms (short barrels, supressors, etc) experience? I know we have some!

    So I'm about to start dabbling in NFA. I aim to start with something relatively simple...a short barreled AR. I know some of the basics...needing to fill out a Form 4 for a tax stamp, registering my existing lower receiver's serial, or buying a new lower to register, fingerprints,$200, engraving the SBR, etc. I also know that to have the NFA firearm transferred to me (as an individual), I wil need passport-type photos and a signature from my Chief LEO (either the police chief in the city i reside in, or the county sheriff).

    I'm fortunate to live in a state that makes NO statutory restrictions on NFA ownership, including machine guns. Getting a signature from a CLEO, however, is a different matter. Some CLEO's aren't well-versed in NFA, and out of ignorance, want nothing to do with putting their signature on a BATFE form authorizing NFA firearms transfer to individuals, even after a fingerprint check. (My residential city's police chief) Some believe that individuals shouldn't own that type of stuff, and if I really need it, my PD would provide it for me, and that's the only acceptable way for me to obtain it. (My democrat county sheriff) It's not a "shall issue" thing like with CCWs, wherein as long as you fulfill statutory requirement, they're obligated to sign your form. It's completely up to the CLEO whether or not they'll sign for you, and that gives them the freedom to interject their own ignorance or political view into the equation. Unfortunately, I don't live in the city that I work in, because our chief has had no problems signing the forms for a couple of guys here who reside in city limits.

    SO, I am looking to set up a trust. I'm not super familiar with it, but the jist I get is that the trust is regarded more like a corporation in the BATFE's eyes, and I (and whoever else I list) am a trustee. The trust (which will be whatever I name it....121traffic's badass gun trust or whatever) will be the technical owner of the firearms I put within the trust's control, and as a trustee I can exercise control over said firearm. It seems that with this method, I would bypass the need for fingerprints, CLEO signature, passport photos, etc, every time I get a new NFA firearm. I would still need to pay $200 for each tax stamp, however, but the process would be very streamlined because the firearms are technically being transferred to the trust, NOT me as an individual.

    I've read a couple different articles online...some say to set up an NFA Firearms Trust, while some say to set up a Revocable Living Trust. Some say they are two different things, some say they are one and the same. Basically, the trust is set up with trustees (i.e. me) and beneficiaries (i.e. who gets my heaters when I die). A guy here at my PD has one set up and got me onto the idea. He says he gets his stamps a lot quicker from BATFE.

    Obviously, I'm going to consult a lawyer about it. I just wanted to hear from anyone here that's knowledgeable about it. Any thoughts? Can I list anyone as a trustee? Can me and a good buddy go in together on one, etc? Just spitballing here. Looking for any and all info.

    Thanks!
    "If anything worthwhile comes of this tragedy, it should be the realization by every citizen that often the only thing that stands between them and losing everything they hold dear... is the man wearing a badge." -- Ronald Reagan, in the wake of the deaths of 4 CHP troopers in the Newhall Incident, 1970

    The opinions given in my posts DO NOT reflect the opinions, views, policies, and/or procedures of my employing agency. They are my personal opinions only, thereby releasing my agency of any liability, or involvement in anything posted under the username "121Traffic" on O/R.

  2. #2
    Five-0's Avatar
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    I have interest. Diesel?

  3. #3
    Xiphos's Avatar
    Xiphos is online now I Void Warranties
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    A friend of mine would get the DA to sign the forms...
    Pleasing nobody, one person at a time.

    That which does not kill me, better start fucking running.

    If I lived every day like it was my last, the body count would be staggering.

    I intend to go in harm's way. -John Paul Jones

    Hunt the wolf, and bring light to the dark places that others fear to go. LT COL Dave Grossman

  4. #4
    BigDawg's Avatar
    BigDawg is offline K-9 Officer
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    I do too, I looked this issue up the other day in reference to a SBR I'm interested in buying. I had trouble understanding alot of the rules.
    "An Unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." Jeff Cooper


    Some people are meant to be the police......Some people are meant to call the police!!!

    "Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell where they already have it."
    -Ronald Reagan


    " I believe that forgiving them (Terrorist) is God's function. OUR job is to arrange the meeting."
    General Norman Schwartzkopf

    Not all Muslims are Terrorists, but all Terrorists are Muslim.
    (author unknown)


    The statements posted by BigDawg DO NOT reflect the opinions, views, policies, or procedures of the author's employing agency. These statements are the personal opinions of BigDawg only, thereby releasing my agency of any liability, or involvement in anything posted under the user name of BigDawg. The opinions expressed by BigDawg are protected by the 1st Amendment of the U.S. Constitution. BigDawg’s messages are intended to invoke thought and discussion among the "Officer Resources" forum community and may not necessarily reflect the opinion of the author. BigDawg’s posts and any attachments are intended for an adult audience (18+) and may contain strong language, sexual content, nudity, violence, and may be graphic in nature. Some material may be considered offensive; reader discretion is advised. Please note that many of BigDawg’s posts are intended for entertainment value only. BigDawg’s posts are not intended to be used where prohibited by law. Furthermore, BigDawg's posts, and any attachments, may contain information covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. 2510-2521, and is confidential and proprietary in nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please be advised that you are legally prohibited from retaining, using, copying, distributing, or otherwise disclosing this information in any manner.

  5. #5
    Five-0's Avatar
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    My boss is the Chief LEO here so I'm good to go there. I know he has signed the forms before.

    Meanwhile, fishing in Russia:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkzV5AIK8iM
    "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." -- Frederic Bastiat

    "Certainly there is no hunting like the hunting of man and those who have hunted armed men long enough and liked it, never really care for anything else thereafter." Ernest Hemingway

    The opinions given in my signatures & threads DO NOT reflect the opinions, views, policies, and/or procedures of my employing agency. They are my personal opinions only, thereby releasing my agency of any liability, or involvement in anything posted under the username "Five-0" on Officerresource.com

  6. #6
    MacLean's Avatar
    MacLean is offline O/R Gun mod
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    Sadly, not possible in my state for an SBR or auto.

    The NFA route for a can is pretty easy though.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  7. #7
    pgg's Avatar
    pgg
    pgg is offline Damnit, I'm hungry again.
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    I want to get a suppressor here. Will have to get a trust probably though. The sheriff is pretty anti gun here.
    'Political Correctness is a doctrine fostered by a
    delusional, illogical liberal minority, and rabidly
    promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which
    holds forth the proposition that it is entirely
    possible to pick up a turd by the clean end!'

    “A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity.” Sigmund Freud

  8. #8
    MacLean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pgg View Post
    I want to get a suppressor here. Will have to get a trust probably though. The sheriff is pretty anti gun here.
    I'm getting ready to do it. We can do it together and compare paperwork.

    I have the paperwork ready for my C&R FFL, too.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  9. #9
    pgg's Avatar
    pgg
    pgg is offline Damnit, I'm hungry again.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacLean View Post
    I'm getting ready to do it. We can do it together and compare paperwork.

    I have the paperwork ready for my C&R FFL, too.
    Sounds good. You need to come up sometime and we will put the new holsters through their paces.
    'Political Correctness is a doctrine fostered by a
    delusional, illogical liberal minority, and rabidly
    promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which
    holds forth the proposition that it is entirely
    possible to pick up a turd by the clean end!'

    “A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity.” Sigmund Freud

  10. #10
    DIESEL326's Avatar
    DIESEL326 is offline Master Officer
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    I have my C&R FFL, and a suppressor. THe C&R was an absolute breeze (and on a side note I got a Spirngfield 1903 for $100 today!!!) and only took a couple of weeks.

    The supressor wasn't much more difficult, it just took a much longer wait. My boss is the CLEO in my case, so a signature was easy enough. I bought direct from the manufacturer, and he handled everything outside of my passport photo and fingerprints. At the time I got mine the wait time was about 5 months, but I hear lately that it is about two.
    An SBR is on my short list, but I will go ahead and tell you that suppressors are more addictive than AR's. I'm already trying to save up for an integrally suppressed .22 pistol and/ or rifle, and then a centerfire pistol suppressor.

    Ahhhhh.....

    Oh yeah.... The Springfield. So I wander into a local pawn shop today killing some time, and I see a sporterized '03 on the rack. I inquire about it and the "gentleman" behind the counter replies "that ain't no Springfield, that's an ole 7mm Mauser." So I ask to see it anyway, and right below where the tag is marked "7mm Mauser", I see a price of $119. So I offered him $100 for the "Mauser" and me and the '03 giggled all the way home! Finally I scored "one of those stories" where I got the incredible deal!
    "Aim small, miss small."

  11. #11
    Five-0's Avatar
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    I see my suppressed Glock 19 [aka the boyfriend gun] sparked your interests.

    Meanwhile, fishing in Russia:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkzV5AIK8iM
    "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." -- Frederic Bastiat

    "Certainly there is no hunting like the hunting of man and those who have hunted armed men long enough and liked it, never really care for anything else thereafter." Ernest Hemingway

    The opinions given in my signatures & threads DO NOT reflect the opinions, views, policies, and/or procedures of my employing agency. They are my personal opinions only, thereby releasing my agency of any liability, or involvement in anything posted under the username "Five-0" on Officerresource.com

  12. #12
    pgg's Avatar
    pgg
    pgg is offline Damnit, I'm hungry again.
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    I want the suppressor for my HK .45 tactical. Hate to see that threaded barrel go to waste.
    'Political Correctness is a doctrine fostered by a
    delusional, illogical liberal minority, and rabidly
    promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which
    holds forth the proposition that it is entirely
    possible to pick up a turd by the clean end!'

    “A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity.” Sigmund Freud

  13. #13
    121Traffic's Avatar
    121Traffic is offline Just Us
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    So, wait. I'm already lost. What is a C&R FFL? Or maybe I know the full name, and just am not linking with the abbreviation.
    "If anything worthwhile comes of this tragedy, it should be the realization by every citizen that often the only thing that stands between them and losing everything they hold dear... is the man wearing a badge." -- Ronald Reagan, in the wake of the deaths of 4 CHP troopers in the Newhall Incident, 1970

    The opinions given in my posts DO NOT reflect the opinions, views, policies, and/or procedures of my employing agency. They are my personal opinions only, thereby releasing my agency of any liability, or involvement in anything posted under the username "121Traffic" on O/R.

  14. #14
    121Traffic's Avatar
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    Ah wait...curio and relic?

    And Bumpity bump bump for any info on trusts?
    "If anything worthwhile comes of this tragedy, it should be the realization by every citizen that often the only thing that stands between them and losing everything they hold dear... is the man wearing a badge." -- Ronald Reagan, in the wake of the deaths of 4 CHP troopers in the Newhall Incident, 1970

    The opinions given in my posts DO NOT reflect the opinions, views, policies, and/or procedures of my employing agency. They are my personal opinions only, thereby releasing my agency of any liability, or involvement in anything posted under the username "121Traffic" on O/R.

  15. #15
    121Traffic's Avatar
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    bump for a great site for info on trusts.

    www.gunlawyer.com

    I've struck out with my city chief. Asshole. Don't bank on much hope for the sheriff. He's a (D) and our FOP lodge didn't endorse him.
    "If anything worthwhile comes of this tragedy, it should be the realization by every citizen that often the only thing that stands between them and losing everything they hold dear... is the man wearing a badge." -- Ronald Reagan, in the wake of the deaths of 4 CHP troopers in the Newhall Incident, 1970

    The opinions given in my posts DO NOT reflect the opinions, views, policies, and/or procedures of my employing agency. They are my personal opinions only, thereby releasing my agency of any liability, or involvement in anything posted under the username "121Traffic" on O/R.

  16. #16
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    121 - if local and county don't work out, have you considered the State Police district commander?

    Those items are specifically banned by law in NY. There is an exception to the law for LEO's, so it appears that I could own it personally (with CLEO signature) but a gun trust would not work in NY. I don't know anyone with an SBR or can, so I don't have any high hopes of the CLEO signing off on anything.
    "never bring paws to a gunfight" - Jenna

  17. #17
    ManImBored is offline Ninja In Training
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    My Sgt. and I have both been looking into the Trust route. Everyone we have talked to said it's the only way to go. They said it is so much easier and actually faster than sending in all the other paperwork. There is an attorney here in Houston that will do the trust for $450. All we have to do is call him and give him all our information and a credit card number and he will send us the trust information a week later. He is also a Class III dealer so we can buy directly from him.
    "Sometimes doing the right thing, is not doing the right thing."

  18. #18
    LawnMM is offline Oppressor of Crackheads
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    I inquired with a guy in Colorado about a trust. Bout 750 to get it set up. Thats added to the 1k I'd spend on a suppressor, and another 200+ for the stamp. Lookin at about 2k for a damn suppressor.

    I think I'm gonna buy some better reloading equipment and rebarrel my rifle first. =/

 

 

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