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  1. #1
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    Brits want their guns back now.

    Dear Brits,

    At this risk of sounding too much like a "We told you so" soceity...

    Well, we did.

    Love,

    The Gun-Toting Citizens of the US (At leats for now)

    YouTube - The British called - They want their guns back!
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then someone isn't thinking." -Gen. George S. Patton

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    I bet they do. I simply don't understand how a person or group of people can believe that a gun ban will reduce the crime rate. This type of thinking simply amazes me.
    No matter what law is inacted I will not remove one legally owned weapon from any law abiding citizen. I will turn in my badge and walk away.
    Do not war for peace. If you must war, war for justice. For without justice there is no peace. -me

    We are who we choose to be.

    R.I.P. Arielle. 08/20/2010-09/16/2012


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    Quote Originally Posted by lewisipso View Post
    I bet they do. I simply don't understand how a person or group of people can believe that a gun ban will reduce the crime rate. This type of thinking simply amazes me.
    No matter what law is inacted I will not remove one legally owned weapon from any law abiding citizen. I will turn in my badge and walk away.


    I think it will begin by "excecutive orders", done in private, at night, without notice. They will first use regulations (CFR) to spare various cowards in Congress having to vote on the record. Expect a lot of secrecy, evasion, deceit, and masked with lawyer-speak.

    I fear the day when our fellow officers must make such a decision. "....to support and defend the Constitution of the United States..." cannot be taken lightly. Was that phrase still in your oath of office when you swore in?

    One great American who faced a deeper conflict of duty and conscience was General Robert E. Lee. When you look at Federal encroachment on the States rights, then and now, General Lee's position and his decision become clearer.
    Some people come into our lives and quickly go. Some stay for awhile and leave footprints on our hearts. And we are never, ever the same.-- Anonymous

    Old People, like me, may not be around to witness the destruction of our Nation. The rest of you may not survive the collapse. We all have the sworn duty to prevent it.

    The light of hope burns brighter than the fires of doom.

  4. #4
    lewisipso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sgtbear111 View Post
    "....to support and defend the Constitution of the United States..." cannot be taken lightly. Was that phrase still in your oath of office when you swore in?
    Yes it was. And I say again...
    I will turn in my badge and walk away.
    I simply cannot do what I would consider an injustice to my fellow man. I love my country and it's core principles but to completely disarm an entire nation is just criminal and injust in my opinion.
    I do this job so that I can offer an attempt at justice for the citizens of my area. If I can no longer, in good conscience, provide that service then my service has come to an end.
    Do not war for peace. If you must war, war for justice. For without justice there is no peace. -me

    We are who we choose to be.

    R.I.P. Arielle. 08/20/2010-09/16/2012


  5. #5
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    I've commented on this clip before on another thread.

    At best it's misleading. The demo at the beginning was about hunting with dogs(foxhunting) not about firearms legislation. The issue of handguns in the general population is misleading as well. Most British people never had handguns or firearms of any kind so it was never like they had them taken away.

    It is still perfectly legal to own shotgun and other firearms, yes you have to have a police issued licence but it has always been that way, in my 27yr service anyway.

    There is a growing problem with firearms in the inner cities, but it really has no relationship to firearms legislation. More to do with an increase in smuggled firearms(eastern europe and porous border controls) and converted imitation firearms.

    the police officer used talking about body armour, well we are issued that more as a resistance to knife attack than ballistic measures as the knife is where our greatest threat still comes from.

    We do have more police firearms officers available than ever and they are at least now permanently deployed as opposed to being on a callout system.

    The Tony Martin thing(shot the burglar) isn't as cut and dried as they make it seem. He was convicted partly on the basis that the burglar was shot in the back as he was clearly running away. There have been many instances where burglary suspects have been killed by homeowners and the homeowner not prosecuted.(She doesn't mention them strangely enough) Each case has to be taken on its merits.

    This report is clearly designed and edited for a particular audience, beware the press my friends, believe it or not they manipulate things!

    We are a very violent nation, allowing guns into the general population would be disastrous. There would be a massacre at every pub fight, every football match every domestic dispute etc.
    the sole advantage of power is that you can do more good.
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  6. #6
    MacLean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Motorwaycop View Post
    Most British people never had handguns or firearms of any kind so it was never like they had them taken away.

    Most British people today.

    Our second amendment comes from English common law.

    We are a very violent nation, allowing guns into the general population would be disastrous. There would be a massacre at every pub fight, every football match every domestic dispute etc.
    We've heard that here before, too.

    "Blood will run in the streets!"

    "It will be like the wild west!"

    These are the types of things they said when States began opening up the carrying of concealed handguns to the populace. In each and every instance, the violent crime rate decreased.

    I think the conversation is somewhat silly however - the British people have the government they tolerate. If they really wanted their guns back, all they need do is take them back.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  7. #7
    Rhino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Motorwaycop View Post
    We are a very violent nation, allowing guns into the general population would be disastrous. There would be a massacre at every pub fight, every football match every domestic dispute etc.
    That is purely speculative. I'd wager our nation is no less violent than yours (probably more so) and we don't have such problems. It sounds to me that sounds like that's what your government wants you to think so that people will be less prepared to defend themselves from the government if it became too oppressive.
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then someone isn't thinking." -Gen. George S. Patton

  8. #8
    countybear's Avatar
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    We are a very violent nation, allowing guns into the general population would be disastrous. There would be a massacre at every pub fight, every football match every domestic dispute etc.
    Pure speculation. Are you suggesting that the US, with its 'Hollywood' portrayals of stark violence, Rap music aggrandization of 'thuglife', and news sensationalism is less violent than your society?

    Holy crap, I agree with Rhino... ??!!??

    "The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money."
    - Alexis de Tocqueville, Democracy in America

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    To war and arms I fly.
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    The opinions expressed by this poster are wholly his own, and should never be construed to even remotely be in representation of his employer, its agencies or assigns. In fact, they probably fail to be in alignment with the opinions of any rational human being.

  9. #9
    Motorwaycop's Avatar
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    Yes my last "massacre" comment was speculative but it was also flippant and not too serious. It continues to be a problem when you have to interpret the written word.

    However I was commenting about a country in which I live and work. I made no reference or comparison to the US.

    The majority of what I said related to the misleading report and I tried to give a balance to what it was saying.

    I continue to work as an unarmed officer in a country where firearms are not in possession of a large number of the general public.Criminals have in the past had access to illegal firearms and will no doubt continue to do so. That is why they are crinimals. If the threat was so great to me from firearms then I could not go to work if meant it was likely that i wouldn't be coming home. A recent poll of all Uk officers gave an oustanding no to being armed. However it also showed we were quite prepared to be armed should the situation require it. I never say never, just no at the moment.

    Besides, personally I'm far too punchy to be trusted with something that goes bang, that's what my colleagues say anyway. It's always the little ones you have to watch!
    the sole advantage of power is that you can do more good.
    ( Baltasar Gracian )

  10. #10
    Kate's Avatar
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    I found this on another forum last week and posted it on my blog. All I kept thinking about is we could be next if we don't do something about it.

  11. #11
    lewisipso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Motorwaycop View Post
    Yes my last "massacre" comment was speculative but it was also flippant and not too serious. It continues to be a problem when you have to interpret the written word.

    95.5. Possession of firearm on premises of alcoholic beverage outlet
    A. No person shall intentionally possess a firearm while on the premises of an alcoholic beverage outlet.
    B. "Alcoholic beverage outlet" as used herein means any commercial establishment in which alcoholic beverages of either high or low alcoholic content are sold in individual servings for consumption on the premises, whether or not such sales are a primary or incidental purpose of the business of the establishment.
    C. The provisions of this Section shall not apply to the owner or lessee of an alcoholic beverage outlet, or to an employee of such owner or lessee, or to a law enforcement officer or other person vested with law enforcement authority acting in the performance of his official duties.
    D. Whoever violates the provisions of this Section shall be fined not more than five hundred dollars or imprisoned for not more than six months, or both.
    Acts 1985, No. 765, 1.




    However I was commenting about a country in which I live and work. I made no reference or comparison to the US.

    The majority of what I said related to the misleading report and I tried to give a balance to what it was saying.

    Understood. Not contridicting what evidence you know of but they broke into his house.. It is just often overlooked that the criminal begins what action was taken against them. And no, I am not condoning shooting someone in the back.


    I continue to work as an unarmed officer in a country where firearms are not in possession of a large number of the general public.Criminals have in the past had access to illegal firearms and will no doubt continue to do so. That is why they are crinimals. If the threat was so great to me from firearms then I could not go to work if meant it was likely that i wouldn't be coming home. A recent poll of all Uk officers gave an oustanding no to being armed. However it also showed we were quite prepared to be armed should the situation require it. I never say never, just no at the moment.

    Besides, personally I'm far too punchy to be trusted with something that goes bang, that's what my colleagues say anyway. It's always the little ones you have to watch!
    Yes it is.
    Do not war for peace. If you must war, war for justice. For without justice there is no peace. -me

    We are who we choose to be.

    R.I.P. Arielle. 08/20/2010-09/16/2012


  12. #12
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    §95.4. Consent to search; alcoholic beverage outlet
    A. Any person entering an alcoholic beverage outlet as defined herein, by the fact of such entering, shall be deemed to have consented to a reasonable search of his person for any firearm by a law enforcement officer or other person vested with police power, without the necessity of a warrant.
    B. For purposes of this Section, "alcoholic beverage outlet" means any commercial establishment in which alcoholic beverages of either high or low alcoholic content are sold in individual servings for consumption on the premises, whether or not such sales are the primary purpose or are an incidental purpose of the business of the establishment.
    C. An "alcoholic beverage outlet" licensed to sell firearms or containing an indoor shooting gallery shall be exempt from the provisions of this Section in those areas designated for the sale of firearms or the shooting gallery.
    D. An "alcoholic beverage outlet" shall not include a restaurant if a majority of its gross receipts are from sales of food and non-alcoholic beverages.
    E. The owner of the alcoholic beverage outlet shall post a sign, at or near the entrance, that states that by the fact of entering these premises a person shall be deemed to have consented to a reasonable search of his person for any firearm by a law enforcement officer or other person vested with police power, without the necessity of a warrant.
    Added by Acts 1983, No. 524, §1.



    Here's another useful tool here.
    Do not war for peace. If you must war, war for justice. For without justice there is no peace. -me

    We are who we choose to be.

    R.I.P. Arielle. 08/20/2010-09/16/2012


  13. #13
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    It has more to do with the society than the guns. This weekend, some idiot killed seven people he didn't know in downtown Portland and then killed himself. Tomorrow, the paper will be full of editorials and irate letters demanding gun control. They don't see the real problem.

    Our culture has changed and for the worst. I'm 63 yrs old, I bought my first gun all by myself from Sears & Roebuck when I was 14. It was a .22 rifle, no paper work, no nothing except I handed the man the money for it and some ammo. That was 1959 and you never heard of killing sprees done just for the hell of it.

    The first I can remember was in the 70's in Killeen, Texas at a Luby's Cafeteria. I think some time later some guy did the same thing at a McDonald's in San Diego. Then the pace started picking up. No matter what we've done to control guns, nothing has slowed or stopped it.

    Isn't it about time to look for the real cause? Maybe a society who thinks it's entitled and gets angry if it doesn't get it? Maybe video games where killing people is the object? Or movies where you see the blood and guts splatter even worse than it ever could in real life?

    When we had our first drive by shooting by a gang member in 1985, the community was outraged and frightened. Less than 10 years later, it became ho hum. My ex partner who was still in uniform told me that in one, the primary response was "at least nobody was hit" and then they went back to their business. A society that anesthetized by violence is probably going to do damn near anything.

    But God forbid we look at real causes and deal with them, let's keep trying to find something worthless to do.....
    When I used to be somebody (I'm center top)

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  14. #14
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    You all are a huge disapointment to president Osama... good for you!!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Retdetsgt View Post
    It has more to do with the society than the guns. This weekend, some idiot killed seven people he didn't know in downtown Portland and then killed himself. Tomorrow, the paper will be full of editorials and irate letters demanding gun control. They don't see the real problem.

    Our culture has changed and for the worst. I'm 63 yrs old, I bought my first gun all by myself from Sears & Roebuck when I was 14. It was a .22 rifle, no paper work, no nothing except I handed the man the money for it and some ammo. That was 1959 and you never heard of killing sprees done just for the hell of it.

    The first I can remember was in the 70's in Killeen, Texas at a Luby's Cafeteria. I think some time later some guy did the same thing at a McDonald's in San Diego. Then the pace started picking up. No matter what we've done to control guns, nothing has slowed or stopped it.

    Isn't it about time to look for the real cause? Maybe a society who thinks it's entitled and gets angry if it doesn't get it? Maybe video games where killing people is the object? Or movies where you see the blood and guts splatter even worse than it ever could in real life?

    When we had our first drive by shooting by a gang member in 1985, the community was outraged and frightened. Less than 10 years later, it became ho hum. My ex partner who was still in uniform told me that in one, the primary response was "at least nobody was hit" and then they went back to their business. A society that anesthetized by violence is probably going to do damn near anything.

    But God forbid we look at real causes and deal with them, let's keep trying to find something worthless to do.....
    Agreed and those "causes" you refer to will never be admitted to. The name of the game is money and when it comes to money no one will ever admit that what they "peddle" or "preach" could possibly have harsh or irresponsible consequences.
    Do not war for peace. If you must war, war for justice. For without justice there is no peace. -me

    We are who we choose to be.

    R.I.P. Arielle. 08/20/2010-09/16/2012


  16. #16
    TXCharlie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Motorwaycop View Post
    There would be a massacre at every pub fight, every football match every domestic dispute etc.
    Then explain why in the USA, there has never been a massacre at any pub, bar, or football game that I know of.

    The only massacres we've had are in places where guns are (or were) banned - Schools, churches, restraunts, post offices, shopping malls, etc. We have bar shootings occasionally, but it's almost always two dumb mf-ers getting mad at each other, and rarely goes much beyond that. Even the shooting in Portland that RDS is talking about injured 7 but only killed two, last I heard - And it was outside the bar, by someone who they don't think had even been in the bar.

    That's why Texas lifted the gun ban in churches, restraunts, malls, and even a lot of local government buildings (with the CHL laws), and CHL holders can even pack in the parking lots of schools, unless it's in one of those dumb Federal "Weapons Free Zones".

    If I'm not mistaken, Texas teachers can now even pack in Texas schools IF they get the School Board's permission in writing and get a CHL, I believe - And students in adult colleges can do the same, if they get the college's permission to pack in the buildings, otherwise they're limited to the parking lots on a CHL alone.

    Unfortunately, the number of teachers and students packing legally with the School Boards' permission is pretty much a secret kept from the public, so I have no idea how many schools have actually authorized that - but we do have armed SRO's (School Resource Officers) in many of our schools now. Since they're all LEO's, there was no public distress over that, and no problems have arizen that I know of - In fact, it was welcomed by the public in light of Columbine, etc.

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  17. #17
    MacLean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TXCharlie View Post
    Then explain why in the USA, there has never been a massacre at any pub, bar, or football game that I know of.
    Charlie, that statement is ignorant.

    I found one right near you in a quick Google search.

    Texas Police Think Bad Debt Led to Shooting Spree in Bar - New York Times

    Freedom has a price, but lets get our facts straight before we land on our UK brothers too hard.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  18. #18
    MacLean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Retdetsgt View Post
    The first I can remember was in the 70's in Killeen, Texas at a Luby's Cafeteria. I think some time later some guy did the same thing at a McDonald's in San Diego
    Luby's was 1991.

    Stockton was in 1989.

    The McDonalds was San Ysidro in 1984.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  19. #19
    Retdetsgt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maclean View Post
    Luby's was 1991.

    Stockton was in 1989.

    The McDonalds was San Ysidro in 1984.
    I've got a good memory, it's just short.....

    The point is that they are all of fairly recent vintage.
    When I used to be somebody (I'm center top)

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    speaking of the brits... has anyone ever heard of the British SAS? they're like our marines.. but waaay more badass.. google them.. it's insane. i love it.

 

 
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