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    Jenna's Avatar
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    15% of US population on food stamps, an increase of 74% since 2007

    Altogether, there are now almost 46 million people in the United States on food stamps, roughly 15 percent of the population. That's an increase of 74 percent since 2007, just before the financial crisis and a deep recession led to mass job losses.
    More here: Country wrestles with spike in food stamp use - money - TODAY.com

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    Damn , I guess I need to find yet another job to pay my fair share of tax money. There are people depending on me to keep them in Bon Bons while they are watching Oprah and Jerry Springer.
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    pgg's Avatar
    pgg
    pgg is offline Damnit, I'm hungry again.
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    There are plenty of farms hiring.
    'Political Correctness is a doctrine fostered by a
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    Quote Originally Posted by pgg View Post
    There are plenty of farms hiring.
    Winning post.

    Of course as long as the government is willing to buy groceries why sweat on a farm? My Grandmother always said "Necessity is the mother of invention." If some of the receivers of food stamps didn't get them anymore they might invent a good reason to work on a farm. Just sayin.
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    Jenna, can you explain to the class how the Obama administration has been pushing food stamps in what they called "underperforming" States?

    I'll wait right here.
    I'm your huckleberry...

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  6. #6
    Jenna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacLean View Post
    Jenna, can you explain to the class how the Obama administration has been pushing food stamps in what they called "underperforming" States?

    I'll wait right here.
    I hope he succeeds.

    Food stamps can save the lives of a lot of people who would otherwise starve. They're a really cheap way to save lives.

    There aren't enough extra farm jobs available to keep all the people who need food stamps alive. And even if there are farm jobs available, not everyone has the ability and opportunity to support themselves as farm laborers. Children, disabled people, mentally ill people, and the elderly aren't able to do enough farm labor to feed themselves. Also most people don't live near a farm with extra farm jobs. Many people have better chances at survival if they are unemployed or underemployed in the city or suburb where they own a home and have friends and relatives who can help them than if they move to places with extra farm jobs, because the moving process would involve travel costs, letting the bank foreclose on the home they own (which they can't sell because they have a bigger mortgage on the home than the home is worth), losing access to nearby friends and relatives who can help with childcare and elder care, and having to pay rent on a home in the area with extra farm jobs that may be more than the mortgage payment on the home in their old neighborhood they gave to the bank, and pay for childcare and elder care while they work instead of getting childcare and elder care for free from friends and relatives in the place they moved from. And even if they get a job for the harvest season, they will lose it after the harvest is over. Many farm jobs don't pay enough to keep people from starving, especially during the winter. So even those with farm jobs might still need food stamps. Many people on food stamps already have minimum wage jobs--those jobs just don't pay enough to keep them and their families froms starving.

    Food stamps also stimulate the economy. When people use them to buy food, jobs are created in the food industries. If you give a billionaire a tax break, it's possible all of it will stay in a bank and not be used to create jobs. But give someone food stamps, and that person is guaranteed to spend every bit of it immediately, which is what is needed to pull the economy out of the recession. See here for how that works: http://money.cnn.com/2008/01/29/news...ysis/index.htm

    Food stamps can't be abused too badly--they can only be used on food and not drugs or guns, for instance. People can only eat so much food, so there's only a limited amount of incentive to use illegal means to get more food stamps than one legally qualifies for. Even if you have enough food stamps to pay for all the food you need, if you don't work you can't buy stuff you want like cars, gasoline, big screen TVs, iphones, drugs, guns, big houses in nice neighborhoods, etc., so people on food stamps still have an incentive to get jobs that pay enough to get them off food stamps so they can get that other stuff. But that only works if such jobs are available.

    Get the economy strong again (by not doing crazy things like hold the debt ceiling hostage) and food stamp usage will drop on its own.

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    Morris is offline Chief Wheaties Pisser
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    The only person in my family tree from before the program was created that has taken the food stamps is my crazy assed mother. That being said, there is one reason why we never took food stamp assistance, ever: we worked. Didn't matter how menial, how depressing the job was, we worked. From truck driving, to orchard work to military service to food service to housekeeping.

    It's a novel concept that many in our nation have seemed to have forgotten.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by pgg View Post
    There are plenty of farms hiring.
    Agreed

    Guy I know that owns a roofing company has been having to turn down jobs (covered up because of the tornado's) because he can't find enough reliable people. Doesn't care if they're experienced or not, just someone that will show up.

  9. #9
    MacLean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenna View Post
    Food stamps can save the lives of a lot of people who would otherwise starve.

    I'm not talking about the starving, Madam Sheep.

    Way to duck the question.

    Food stamp usage is being increased intentionally, not out of need.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


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    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  10. #10
    lewisipso's Avatar
    lewisipso is offline Injustice/Indifference/In God we trust
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenna View Post
    Food stamps can't be abused too badly--they can only be used on food and not drugs or guns, for instance. People can only eat so much food, so there's only a limited amount of incentive to use illegal means to get more food stamps than one legally qualifies for. Even if you have enough food stamps to pay for all the food you need, if you don't work you can't buy stuff you want like cars, gasoline, big screen TVs, iphones, drugs, guns, .
    Oh yes they can. Only the practitioners of the "art" know how to do it. The "stamps" can only be used on food true. If it is a true stamp, items can be bought and the change pocketed just like regular money. If it is a card as it is here the PIN number can be given to the local dealer and drugs bought with groceries. Even dealers have to eat. Or the food can be sold for cash money. (yes it does happen) It's also tax free. I know for a fact that vehicles have been purchased with food stamps. The vehicles can then be used, further traded or sold for cash money. If you think a firearm can't be bought with food I have news for you.
    The poor, mental, and otherwise handicapped often have their cards or stamps taken from them by their care givers and used in the above fashion. A program is great but if you have no way of policing a program then rampant abuse will happen. There is no perfect system I know but this type of abuse is everywhere and done frequently every month. The trick is they have to be caught.
    How do I know? I have investigated a lot of these cases over the years as I am sure other people here have. However, since it is reprehensible to keep food out of a participants mouth there are no punishments for the fraud that I've seen. If a person is actually removed from the system they have someone else sign up. Hell, people just shack up so that the true "family" income isn't reported and both parties can qualify for assistance. Then one card is used for food and the other for bartering or otherwise illegal activities.
    You may think this is an over reaction but in local communities it is not uncommon to have case workers related to half of the people they are suppose to supervise. Would you kick a relative off of assistance? Not many would. This is very common and only people familiar with the way it is done know or care to know. We know this is done because we deal with it all the time. The government could care less because it is a feel good "solution".
    There. We have successfully stopped an arterial bleed with a band aid. Let's move on to the next problem and not worry about that any more. jmo.
    Do not war for peace. If you must war, war for justice. For without justice there is no peace. -me

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    R.I.P. Arielle. 08/20/2010-09/16/2012


  11. #11
    MacLean's Avatar
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    Our local news station does shows on people selling their "food stamps" for cash all the time.

    You go in to the store with your quest card, the store bills you $200, and you leave with $100 cash.

    To spend on drugs, booze, etc.

    Can't be abused my ass, it is the most fraudulently abused program in the United States.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

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    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  12. #12
    lewisipso's Avatar
    lewisipso is offline Injustice/Indifference/In God we trust
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    That and Medicare/Medicaid.
    Do not war for peace. If you must war, war for justice. For without justice there is no peace. -me

    We are who we choose to be.

    R.I.P. Arielle. 08/20/2010-09/16/2012


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    MacLean's Avatar
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    Here if you make an arrest or seize the card, DSHS will still give them another one like nothing happened.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  14. #14
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    I just want some of that government cheese.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lewisipso View Post
    Oh yes they can. Only the practitioners of the "art" know how to do it. The "stamps" can only be used on food true. If it is a true stamp, items can be bought and the change pocketed just like regular money. If it is a card as it is here the PIN number can be given to the local dealer and drugs bought with groceries. Even dealers have to eat. Or the food can be sold for cash money. (yes it does happen) It's also tax free. I know for a fact that vehicles have been purchased with food stamps. The vehicles can then be used, further traded or sold for cash money. If you think a firearm can't be bought with food I have news for you.
    The poor, mental, and otherwise handicapped often have their cards or stamps taken from them by their care givers and used in the above fashion. A program is great but if you have no way of policing a program then rampant abuse will happen. There is no perfect system I know but this type of abuse is everywhere and done frequently every month. The trick is they have to be caught.
    How do I know? I have investigated a lot of these cases over the years as I am sure other people here have. However, since it is reprehensible to keep food out of a participants mouth there are no punishments for the fraud that I've seen. If a person is actually removed from the system they have someone else sign up. Hell, people just shack up so that the true "family" income isn't reported and both parties can qualify for assistance. Then one card is used for food and the other for bartering or otherwise illegal activities.
    You may think this is an over reaction but in local communities it is not uncommon to have case workers related to half of the people they are suppose to supervise. Would you kick a relative off of assistance? Not many would. This is very common and only people familiar with the way it is done know or care to know. We know this is done because we deal with it all the time. The government could care less because it is a feel good "solution".
    There. We have successfully stopped an arterial bleed with a band aid. Let's move on to the next problem and not worry about that any more. jmo.

    This times a bajillion. I've seen them walk out of the store with groceries, leave, then return a short time later to return the groceries and buy beer, smokes, electronics, and toys with the Wal Mart cash card given to refund their purchase.


    Jenna, this happens everywhere and quite frequently. In fact, I would be so bold as to say that in my area there are more abusers on the system than there are people with a genuine need.

    If they aren't abusing it as Lew described above, they are buying steak, lobster, large quantities of name brand soda, and every other non essential food or junk food item they can find for themselves while the kids are stuck eating beans and hot dogs.
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  16. #16
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    Just to play devil's advocate...what about those who truly do need it and use it wisely? I have a friend who is married and has two children. He gets $154 in food stamps every month to feed a family of four. Yeah, that's pretty much nothing...I spend that in one week. When they do their shopping, they get meat, fresh vegetables, and what they will need to eat for a week or two. Every once in a while, sure, they get the crap whether it be ice cream or soda. But, he's responsible with it and without that extra money, they'd probably be eating ramen for a couple of weeks out of the month. It can do good (though, I know as much as anyone, that this family is probably the exception, rather than the rule).

    I'm not advocating wide-spread use of food stamps, and I think there should be some limits. The system is broken, for sure, but that doesn't mean that every once in a while it doesn't help.
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    MacLean's Avatar
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    People who need it and use it wisely are what the program is intended for.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

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    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
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  18. #18
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    In my old area we could watch people on the first of the month selling their food stamps for 50 cents on the dollar. The state didn't care and wouldn't enforce anything. We called it "mothers day" because there would be this rush to sell the stamps and then that night you were responding to drunk/drug calls. All with the same people.

    I had a talk with my Sgt here last night about this. He said in his 20 years of working the road here he hasn't seen a single person that get food stamps and doesn't abuse it. His thoughts were to do away from the whole system.
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    A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity. Sigmund Freud

  19. #19
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    Checkmate in one:

    "I am for doing good to the poor, but...I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it. I observed...that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves, and of course became poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves, and became richer."

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  20. #20
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    Bust hump or starve. I support limits for how long you should be able to get public assistance and believe people should have to take random drug tests to get support at all.
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