View Poll Results: Of your 320 closest friends/family how many are in prison, parole, or probation?
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12-09-06, 01:49 PM #1
USA = #1, beating China and Russia (in number of people incarcerated) :p
I think it's amazing that 1 in every 32 American adults was in jail/prison or on probation or parole at the end of last year. I know at least 320 American adults, so if all Americans hung out with the same crowd, I would know 10 incarcerated people, and yet I know none. How many incarcerated people do you know?
Also amazing that the US has more prisoners than countries several times bigger.
U.S. has most prisoners in world due to tough laws By James Vicini
December 8, 2006
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Tough sentencing laws, record numbers of drug offenders and high crime rates have contributed to the United States having the largest prison population and the highest rate of incarceration in the world, according to criminal justice experts.
A U.S. Justice Department report released on November 30 showed that a record 7 million people -- or one in every 32 American adults -- were behind bars, on probation or on parole at the end of last year. Of the total, 2.2 million were in prison or jail.
According to the International Center for Prison Studies at King's College in London, more people are behind bars in the United States than in any other country. China ranks second with 1.5 million prisoners, followed by Russia with 870,000.
The U.S. incarceration rate of 737 per 100,000 people in the highest, followed by 611 in Russia and 547 for St. Kitts and Nevis. In contrast, the incarceration rates in many Western industrial nations range around 100 per 100,000 people.
Groups advocating reform of U.S. sentencing laws seized on the latest U.S. prison population figures showing admissions of inmates have been rising even faster than the numbers of prisoners who have been released.
"The United States has 5 percent of the world's population and 25 percent of the world's incarcerated population. We rank first in the world in locking up our fellow citizens," said Ethan Nadelmann of the Drug Policy Alliance, which supports alternatives in the war on drugs.
"We now imprison more people for drug law violations than all of western Europe, with a much larger population, incarcerates for all offenses."
Ryan King, a policy analyst at The Sentencing Project, a group advocating sentencing reform, said the United States has a more punitive criminal justice system than other countries.
MORE PEOPLE TO PRISON
"We send more people to prison, for more different offenses, for longer periods of time than anybody else," he said.
Drug offenders account for about 2 million of the 7 million in prison, on probation or parole, King said, adding that other countries often stress treatment instead of incarceration.
Commenting on what the prison figures show about U.S. society, King said various social programs, including those dealing with education, poverty, urban development, health care and child care, have failed.
"There are a number of social programs we have failed to deliver. There are systemic failures going on," he said. "A lot of these people then end up in the criminal justice system."
Kent Scheidegger, legal director of the Criminal Justice Legal Foundation in California, said the high prison numbers represented a proper response to the crime problem in the United States. Locking up more criminals has contributed to lower crime rates, he said.
"The hand-wringing over the incarceration rate is missing the mark," he said.
Scheidegger said the high prison population reflected cultural differences, with the United States having far higher crimes rates than European nations or Japan. "We have more crime. More crime gets you more prisoners."
Julie Stewart, president of the group Families Against Mandatory Minimums, cited the Justice Department report and said drug offenders are clogging the U.S. justice system.
"Why are so many people in prison? Blame mandatory sentencing laws and the record number of nonviolent drug offenders subject to them," she said.
Last edited by Jenna; 12-09-06 at 10:42 PM.
12-09-06, 02:06 PM #2
Every dirtbag behind bars is a dirtbag that is not committing crimes against innocent people on the street. I think we need more people in prison."I'm not a coward,
I've just never been tested
I'd like to think that if I was,
I would pass"
~Mighty Mighty Bosstones~
12-09-06, 02:57 PM #3
Nephew; killed his mother.
I think he belongs there.
We are the thin blue line
and all the money in the world.
And no you can't have any.
12-09-06, 02:59 PM #4
Not being snarky, but I wonder how many of those 32 people got counted more than once because they were convicted of crimes in multiple jurisdictions or went through the "system" multiple times?
I know several people(clients, not friends) that are on probation in at least two different States at the same time. Remember that truck driver that hit and killed the Nashville officer on a motorist assist a while back? He got probation out of TN, and he is also currently on probation in KY.
I wonder if I committed a "non-violent" crime and received probation/parole in each State, would I be counted as 50 people because each State lists me as a single person on probation or parole?
12-09-06, 03:23 PM #5
One only needs to drive through the urban area of any of our major cities to see that we are losing the war on drugs, I think a new approach is needed, drugs should be a public health war rather than a criminal justice war, I know a lot of crimes are connected to the drug trade, turf wars by dealers, theft and child neglect by addicts ect..., those crimes should certainly be prosecuted without regard for the motive, I'm against giving leniency to offenders because they are addicts, but I'm also against spending billions in tax dollars chasing drug dealers and users, if they want to destroy themselves with drugs then so be it, once they start committing crimes to support their habit then they should be prosecuted the same as anyone else.
I worked in human services before entering Law Enforcement and I learned that you cannot force an addict to stop using, the threat of prison just doesn't do it, our tax dollars would be better spent on programs for addicts who WANT to get clean rather than on addicts who want to use drugs but are incarcerated or forced into programs.
How many of you have arrested an addict for possession and they boo hooed all over the place about how they were in the process of getting clean and how they just needed you to give them a break (not arrest them) so they could get into a program, then (whether you arrest them or not) you catch them again for possession or hear that another officer caught them for possession ?
They knew if they were caught they were going to jail, they've been arrested for possession over and over again, but they don't really worry until they actually get caught again, the law is not a detterent to these people.
Life is about choices and consequences, if you choose to smoke cigarretes then as a consequence you risk getting cancer, if you choose to abuse alchohol then as a consequence you risk health, financial and social problems, however when you drink and drive or become violent because of your alchohol abuse that's where the law steps in, I think the same approach should be taken with drug abuse.
Last edited by constablechuck; 12-09-06 at 03:47 PM.
12-09-06, 03:43 PM #6
In China and russia the cops beat the crap out of people to deture crime. I guess if the govt/citizens would want we could give that a try for a while and see if it works
12-09-06, 03:50 PM #7
There is something to be said for the effectiveness of "curbside adjudications", however those days are "officially" long gone here in the U.S.
12-09-06, 05:28 PM #8
12-09-06, 05:44 PM #9
Does my sister having a warrant count? lol
Well, actually she's my step sister and I tried to run her to confirm it's not Canada wide. If it is, she's getting arrested during our boxing day breakfast, by yours truely.
If it's Alberta wide, I'm going to leave it until I talk too her about her surrender!!! (The dumbass wrote some bad checks)
12-09-06, 06:27 PM #10
America is all about freedom, including the freedom to screw up and go to jail.
Difference between us, China and Russia, is that we don't haul people off to the side of the road and shoot them for it. If we did, then yeah, I bet our prison populations would drop, too.\\` ` ` ` < ` )___/\
`` ` ` ` (3--(____)
"...but to forget your duck, of course, means you're really screwed." - Gary Larson
12-09-06, 07:49 PM #11
i had a very close friend that also roomed with me while i was in college who robbed 8 banks over a one year period and eventually got caught on the 8th one. he spent 5 years in federal prison at fort dix. the funny thing is, you would have never known he was robbing banks. he was a great friend, he was never in trouble with the law, he didnt use drugs, he barely even drank alcohol. he always seemed to have money though. he worked while we were in school, so i figured that accounted for his income...i was wrong.
so hes been out for a few years now and is still on parole or probation, not sure which. my father owns a construction business, and actually gave him a job upon his release. but he started stealing from my father, and doing side jobs, and eventually got too entangled in his own lies to keep his stories straight. this bahvior was also completely unlike him, he had worked for my father prior to his arrest, and was one of his best employees. rather then report him and send him back to jail, my pops decided to just fire him and be done with him.
needless to say, due to my profession, i pretty much had to cut ties with him after he was convicted, but when my dad gave him a job i was happy. i thought it might get him back on track. i guess he just went totally down hill though, and he ended up screwing over everyone who wanted to help give him a second chance.
thats the only close friend ive ever had end up in serious trouble with the law though. ive had friends and acquiantances (spelling?)from high school end up in some trouble, but hes the only one that i ever really cared about.in the warriors code there's no surrender, though his body says stop, his spirit cries...NEVER. deep in our souls, a quiet ember, knows its you against you, its the paradox that drives us all. its a battle of wills, in the heat of attack, its the passion that kills, and victory is yours alone.
the posts and opinions stated by me do not in any way reflect the values, beliefs, or views of my department. they are simply opinions and/or observations which have been developed through my personal experiences. hell, most of the stories probably arent even true...wink wink
12-09-06, 10:47 PM #12
12-10-06, 05:59 AM #13Banned
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If I had 320 close friends and family I'd start my own country.
I don't, so if I voted I'd just throw off the poll. If I did vote, it'd be 0.
12-10-06, 08:56 PM #14
Just a couple of family members put in jail for DUI, but they're no longer in the system - that I know of
But one is still finding it VERY difficult to find a job after the Class B misdemeanor went on his record - He can't pass any pre-employment BG checks now. That was his worst punishment, and it's gonna stay with him for a long time.
I'm with you Bug... The only way I could find 320 friends is if I won the Lotto.
Yeah, like Ducky said, screw up in China or Russia and they may find your body in a ditch... Also a lot of them die an early death in prison from poor medical care. That saves on bedspace too. Our prisioners get better medical care than our vets in many cases.
Last edited by TXCharlie; 12-10-06 at 09:47 PM.
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12-10-06, 11:59 PM #15Master OfficerVerified LEO
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Funny but I also picked up on the 320 number. Not only don't I have 320 close friends, I'm not sure I can find 320 people that still talk to me.
I don't think that's a bad thing, either.If I wanted people to like me I'd be a fireman.
12-11-06, 03:53 AM #16
A lot of those countries simply deny having that many (they simply disappear). Many simply execute certain criminals. Others just legalize behavior that would get you prison time elsewhere. And a lot of folks just behave themselves."Government is not reason, it is not eloquence, it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. Never for a moment should it be left to irresponsible actions." ~ George Washington.
A Dead Enemy Is A Peaceful Enemy - Blessed Be The Peacemakers.
12-11-06, 05:01 AM #17
Business is good, crime is up. Job security
... Time to buy that new hot rod. I hear Corvette is making a 500hp production car now!
12-11-06, 10:30 AM #18
I think the high incarceration rate is due to lax laws not being enough of a deterrent. If they were sentenced to "X" number of years and served exactly "X" number of years then there would be a deterrence factor.
I also think all prisons should be lock down style. No rec yard, NO WEIGHTS that make super predators when they come out, and no suing the system b/c you only have reebok and cant get nike in your jails,,,,,,,
Sheriff Joe Arpaio in Arizona has the right idea!...........................................
12-11-06, 10:31 AM #19
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