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  1. #1
    smokey703's Avatar
    smokey703 is offline I'm Bi-WINNING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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    17-year-old shoots carjacker who pulled gun on youth's mother

    17-year-old shoots carjacker who pulled gun on youth's mother


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    METAIRIE, La. (AP) -- A man with a gun was trying to force a woman out of her car at a fast-food drive-through when the woman's 17-year-old son wrestled the gun away from him and shot him.

    Carl Chestnut, 44, of Kenner, is expected to survive wounds to his head and body, and will face armed robbery charges once he is released from East Jefferson General Hospital, Col. John Fortunato, a Jefferson Parish Sheriff's Office spokesman, said Monday.

    It would have been safer to hand over the keys and let the gunman drive off, Sheriff Harry Lee said Monday.

    Fortunato said the 53-year-old woman was in line at an Arby's Roast Beef Restaurant about 1:30 a.m. Monday when Chestnut walked up and pointed a gun at her, demanding their money and the car.

    When he leaned inside, aiming the gun with one hand and trying to yank her out with the other, the 17-year-old grabbed the gun, Fortunato said. He said it went off once as they strugged, but did not hit anyone. Once the youth got the gun, he shot Chestnut several times, Fortunato said.

    Sylena Rhodes, a corporate officer for Arby's, said, "He saved his mother's life. He's a hero. He's an absolute hero."

    Lee acknowledged that the gamble succeeded, but said it was one that could have cost lives. He repeated advice that the best way to survive a holdup is to cooperate.

    "Give them the money and give them the keys. You make an insurance payment on your car, and nobody gets shot," he said.

    ---
    Wise men stand behind me, brave men stand beside me, but only fools stand against me.

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  2. #2
    Jackalope's Avatar
    Jackalope is offline Yell O
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    It would have been safer to hand over the keys and let the gunman drive off, Sheriff Harry Lee said Monday.
    Yeah, well, it would be safer still to permanently lock yourself in the house, draw the shades, and hide under a pile of coats in the closet. Encouraging people to act like sheep will only embolden the wolves.

    The kid is a hero, and the Sheriff ought to be honoring him as such.
    "I'm not a coward,
    I've just never been tested
    I'd like to think that if I was,
    I would pass"
    ~Mighty Mighty Bosstones~

  3. #3
    BEB
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    Criminals hear these messages too. Some who wouldn't try armed robbery are surely encouraged by this. Even if they didn't go out with the intent to actually use the gun inevitably people get killed during those encounters.

    True, often it is better to surrender the battle to win the war. But when someone wins the battle don't castigate him!

    "Better die standing than live kneeling."--Pericles

    Maybe cowering would be more apt these days. That's how some would have it anyway.

  4. #4
    121Traffic's Avatar
    121Traffic is offline Just Us
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    I am pretty sickened by the Sheriff's view as well.
    "If anything worthwhile comes of this tragedy, it should be the realization by every citizen that often the only thing that stands between them and losing everything they hold dear... is the man wearing a badge." -- Ronald Reagan, in the wake of the deaths of 4 CHP troopers in the Newhall Incident, 1970

    The opinions given in my posts DO NOT reflect the opinions, views, policies, and/or procedures of my employing agency. They are my personal opinions only, thereby releasing my agency of any liability, or involvement in anything posted under the username "121Traffic" on O/R.

  5. #5
    Rhino's Avatar
    Rhino is offline Meat-eater & Fire-breather
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackalope View Post
    Yeah, well, it would be safer still to permanently lock yourself in the house, draw the shades, and hide under a pile of coats in the closet. Encouraging people to act like sheep will only embolden the wolves.

    The kid is a hero, and the Sheriff ought to be honoring him as such.
    Amen, Brother. A-freaking-men.
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then someone isn't thinking." -Gen. George S. Patton

  6. #6
    TXCharlie's Avatar
    TXCharlie is offline Former & Future Reserve Officer
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    Quote Originally Posted by 121Traffic View Post
    I am pretty sickened by the Sheriff's view as well.
    +1

    The Sheriff's comments are to be expected, but I disagree with them 100%. Everytime something happens like that around here, some damn Chief or Police PR wimp gets on TV and says something like that.

    By stopping that carjacker he may have saved the lives of future victims of that same carjacker - No telling how many crimes he would have committed before he was caught, and I seriously doubt that this was his first violent crime, either.

    The older members of this forum probably remember me talking about a buddy at our gun club who shot a carjacker in the chest a year or two ago with a .44 Magnum - The scumbag lived, but the bullet dang near blew his whole shoulder blade off when it exited. My buddy kept his .44 in a holster by his seat belt, because he'd been carjacked before. When the guy stuck a 9mm in his face, he told him he was gonna unbuckle his seat belt, knocked the 9mm out of his face and grabbed his revolver.

    After it was over with, he was sitting in the back of a police car for an hour starting to get worried that he was in trouble until they found the carjacker's gun in some bushes - After that a big burly Sargent came up to him and said "You got that SOB real good didn't you?" They took his statement and sent him on his way.

    The PR guy said pretty much the same thing about that shooting - the news media should have interviewed the Sargent instead.

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  7. #7
    mavriktu's Avatar
    mavriktu is offline Patrol Sgt.
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    I know Sheriff Lee,he is one of the most popular top cops in these parts.I can assure you that what he said is NOT what he meant.It is called CYA,if he reccomended everyone fight back,and they got hurt or killed,whos' gonna get sued? the bad guy,?I think not!

  8. #8
    Twan007's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mavriktu View Post
    I know Sheriff Lee,he is one of the most popular top cops in these parts.I can assure you that what he said is NOT what he meant.It is called CYA,if he reccomended everyone fight back,and they got hurt or killed,whos' gonna get sued? the bad guy,?I think not!
    absolutely... there are a few Sheriff's out there who are worthy of a ton of praise... Harry Lee is one of them...

    and yeah, I agree... it's a total CYA approach, the man has bigger nuts than a dump truck... but he's not stupid
    -=Twan007


    Lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine.

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  9. #9
    TXCharlie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mavriktu View Post
    It is called CYA,if he reccomended everyone fight back,and they got hurt or killed,whos' gonna get sued? the bad guy,?I think not!
    How can he be sued for saying that? When has a Chief or Sheriff EVER been sued for saying that?

    He can always do a CYA by saying it's at the victim's own risk, it's dangerous, and no one should try it unless they get training - but he can absolutely encourage people to fight back without being sucessfully sued if he phrases it correctly.

    Someone may try to sue him, but I doubt that they'd be succesful if he encourages people to get self-defense training first. Then it's up to them to get the correct training. If they don't follow that suggestion, then too bad.

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  10. #10
    BEB
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    Good to hear, Mav and Twan. I wish the general public could get the same message. I'll know Sheriff Lee, based on you two vouching for him, isn't a no nuts bureaucrat. Sadly that message will end here and the AP report will be the public record on this.

    I don't have a solution to this LE/public interface problem. Wish I did.

  11. #11
    Jenna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackalope View Post
    Yeah, well, it would be safer still to permanently lock yourself in the house, draw the shades, and hide under a pile of coats in the closet.
    I do that all the time!

  12. #12
    countybear's Avatar
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    For those who need better reference of who Harry Lee is...

    He's the Sheriff who told the NAACP to kiss his ass when one of his deputies stopped a minority in an all white neighborhood, did a field contact on him, which led to a break in a string of burglaries (and armed robberies) over the course of a 3 year period of time. He called the deputy's actions, "damn good police work." He told the ACLU attorney that anything out of the ordinary was reasonable in which to base suspicion for a field interview, ESPECIALLY when someone "just didn't belong", and his people weren't going to back down from that, because that's what he ordered them to do.

    He was also the Sheriff who blockaded a Mississippi River Bridge during Katrina, thus refusing to allow pedestrian looters and fugitives to cross into his Parish. (They were ordered to evacuate prior to Katrina, and organized evacuations post-Katrina were underway).

    Although the Parish President evacuated his people to the North Shore of the Pontchartrain to wait out the storm when Katrina hit, Harry kept his in place, never asked for outside assistance, and for a week they stood... looting in his Parish was isolated.

    He commandeered all Wal-Marts and Sam's Stores immediately after the storm, ordering them to open after FEMA demanded they stay closed. He ordered his deputies to arrest ANY FEMA personnel who attempted to close a store in his Parish.

    The man has balls of steel.

    "It's more difficult for somebody to accuse me of being a racist, when you figure I was born in the back room of a Chinese laundry. When I was a kid, I was called a 'chink,'" he says.
    A February, 2007 quote from Harry (when again, the NAACP lambasted hiim for telling his deputies to perform Terry stops in high crime areas of blacks hanging on the streetcorners):

    “The NAACP didn't like my plan. I said, ‘Okay, you don't like my plan, we'll use your plan.’ They said, ‘We don't have a plan.’ Well then shut up and let me do my job.’”

    "The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money."
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  13. #13
    mfranklin01's Avatar
    mfranklin01 is offline its not vendication...its punishment
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    Sheriff Lee is almost on the same lvl at the sheriff in arizona (whos name i can never remember) he doesn't care about the media or being sued...he does care however about giving the go ahead for people that would not have the testicular fortitude to actually pull the trigger of a gun if they had one. I think what Sheriff Lee did was absolutely the right thing to do.
    "Be Polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet"

  14. #14
    Twan007's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smokey703 View Post
    It would have been safer to hand over the keys and let the gunman drive off, Sheriff Harry Lee said Monday.

    ...


    Lee acknowledged that the gamble succeeded, but said it was one that could have cost lives. He repeated advice that the best way to survive a holdup is to cooperate.

    "Give them the money and give them the keys. You make an insurance payment on your car, and nobody gets shot," he said.

    ---
    I think we've blown the quote out of proportion. Sheriff said the safer thing to do... the best way to survive... is to hand the keys/wallet/whatever over... and never once said not to do anything about it...

    just an added .02
    -=Twan007


    Lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine.

    Not one shred of evidence supports the notion that life is serious.





    The opinions expressed by this poster are wholly his own, and should never be construed to even remotely be in alignment with his employer. Matter of fact, the poster will deny any knowledge of any post... this message will self-destruct in 5 seconds...

  15. #15
    mfranklin01's Avatar
    mfranklin01 is offline its not vendication...its punishment
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twan007 View Post
    I think we've blown the quote out of proportion. Sheriff said the safer thing to do... the best way to survive... is to hand the keys/wallet/whatever over... and never once said not to do anything about it...

    just an added .02
    you just might be right twan. but its still fun to argue
    "Be Polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet"

  16. #16
    Ianl6's Avatar
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    Smile

    I'm not LE and i dont live in your Country but i think Harry Lee sounds like a bloody good man to have with you.From reading some of the things he has done he is a man who deserves a pat on the back not to be criticised.
    Public conscience message board
    post on a board with a heart.

    http://dreamboyuk52.proboards60.com/index.cgi

  17. #17
    mavriktu's Avatar
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    Actually,knowing Harry,that 17 y/o kid is most likely,on the SO firing range today,with an instuctor ,learning how to get it right next time.

  18. #18
    Ducky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mavriktu View Post
    Actually,knowing Harry,that 17 y/o kid is most likely,on the SO firing range today,with an instuctor ,learning how to get it right next time.
    That's my kind of gun control!
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  19. #19
    conalabu is offline Grasshopper
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    Chuck, pick your foot up, you stepping on your dick again. He can be sued for giving the go ahead on jerking guns out of a perps hands and shooting back. That is an enormous liablity issue. People are dumb, they will do something, get hurt and look for the first person to blame. You may be right, such a suit might not survive in court. But the attidtude of most councils is going to be... settle. That is what they have insurance for. Then the Sheriff gets shitted by the council for the next four years. Need to watch that whole assumptions thing, Chuck.
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  20. #20
    TXCharlie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by conalabu View Post
    He can be sued for giving the go ahead on jerking guns out of a perps hands and shooting back.
    I agree it would be reckless if he phrased it that way - but I was thinking along the lines of encouraging everyone to get self-defense training and learning when & how to fight back rather than giving specific tactical advice in a sound byte.

    I think it's just as reckless to encourage people to blindly obey their attacker's commands, because sometimes that works, and sometimes it doesn't.

    I would like to see a few Chief's sued by victims who followed orders and didn't resist per the PD's advice, but still got shot, raped, or maimed - I think suing PD's that say stuff like that would be a healthy balance.

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