An atheist soldier suing over prayers at military formations claims a larger pattern of religious discrimination exists in the military

**Terminator** · 12-30-08, 07:33 PM

TOPEKA, Kan. (AP) - An atheist soldier suing over prayers at military formations claims a larger pattern of religious discrimination exists in the military, citing attempts to convert Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan and an evangelical bias in a suicide prevention manual. The expanded lawsuit filed Monday by Spc. Dustin Chalker and the Military Religious Freedom Foundation in U.S. District Court in Kansas City also claims the military doesn't take complaints of religious discrimination seriously enough.
The Defense Department has identified fewer than 50 complaints about alleged violations of religious freedoms during the past three years, with 1.4 million personnel in uniform, spokeswoman Eileen Lainez said.
She declined to comment on a pending lawsuit but noted that the military has policies against endorsing any religious view.
The revised lawsuit criticizes the Army's 2008 manual on suicide prevention, quoting it as promoting "religiosity" as a necessary part of prevention and describing "connectivity to the divine" as "fundamental."
The lawsuit cites comments from a chaplain and a second soldier in Christian missionary publications about attempts to convert Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan, including the two soldiers' desire to distribute Bibles.
The lawsuit also notes that in 2007, the Air Force sponsored "Team Faith," which performs motocross stunt shows to "lead extreme sports athletes to Christ."
The original lawsuit filed in September alleged Chalker had to attend events at Fort Riley where Christian prayers were given. Foundation president Mikey Weinstein said Chalker tried to pursue his complaints within the Army but was told they were "unfounded."
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**MacLean** · 12-30-08, 08:10 PM

Wonder what the real story is behind Specialist Chalker.

**countybear** · 12-30-08, 09:04 PM

Again, let's review:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

Where does that say that the law should prohibit the exercise of one's religious beliefs in the presence of others for the purpose of 'sensitivity' to atheism?

Where does that say that a branch of the armed services cannot support a community organization if it happens to espouse a certain faith?

Where does it say that this dickhead should profit 1 penny because he claims to be offended by the practice of religion around him?

Spc. Chalker... up yours.

**Bird18751** · 12-30-08, 09:06 PM

Bet when he gets pinned down by enemy fire, he begins to believe that just in case there is another place, he better pray.

**Captain America** · 12-30-08, 09:17 PM

I don't believe in atheism. Since I'm one person, atheism should be outlawed in the United States because what I believe is more important than what a group of people believe. I don't want to be tolerant of other peoples beliefs, thats not what this country was founded on. If it doesn't happened , I'm suing.

**Jenna** · 12-30-08, 09:21 PM

Originally Posted by Captain America

I don't believe in atheism.

It would take more faith to be an atheist than it would to have a religion. It's much harder to prove a negative (e.g. that something doesn't exist) than it is to prove that something does exist.

**CTR man** · 12-30-08, 09:28 PM

Originally Posted by countybear

Again, let's review:

Where does that say that the law should prohibit the exercise of one's religious beliefs in the presence of others for the purpose of 'sensitivity' to atheism?

Where does that say that a branch of the armed services cannot support a community organization if it happens to espouse a certain faith?

Where does it say that this dickhead should profit 1 penny because he claims to be offended by the practice of religion around him?

Spc. Chalker... up yours.

The original lawsuit filed in September alleged Chalker had to attend events at Fort Riley where Christian prayers were given. Foundation president Mikey Weinstein said Chalker tried to pursue his complaints within the Army but was told they were "unfounded."

I seriously doubt that Spc. Chalker is going to get anywhere with the military in this regard. If he doesn't want to hear the prayers then he has the right to not listen to them. But to keep others from doing so, crosses the line in my opinion.

**countybear** · 12-30-08, 09:49 PM

"There are no atheists in foxholes..." - Lt. Col. Wm J. Clear

**Morris** · 12-31-08, 12:35 AM

The kid's soup sandwich or ate up.

That being said, it was awfully quiet in the barracks during basic training as I was one of the few who didn't escape to church on Sundays. I learned by week three that I could pretend well. I will confirm that there are some zealous religious supporters in the command ranks in some branches. Most were fine with my belief structure and I respected theirs.

While the federal constitution respects the freedom of religion, it doesn't mandate you belong to one. To my knowledge, the specialist wasn't forced to endure anything and if he did, a quick call to Social Actions usually clears that up. That being said, even in my beliefs, I recognize that these United States are predominately a Judeo-Christian country with a long belief structure and system in Jesus Christ. Understand, work with the system, be respectful and things go fine here in the US.

**MacLean** · 12-31-08, 02:24 AM

I was never forced to go to church either - although I had the choice of seven different versions to go to, including Wiccan.

I firmly believe these guys enter the service with the intent of engineering their brand of social change.

Watada is another example. The war he feels is illegal is going on when he joins, so that he can refuse to go when he's told.

I'm just not buying this as "just another agrieved Specialist."

**lewisipso** · 12-31-08, 10:01 AM

I suing for my right to be a Christian where ever I please. Any time I want to.

**Radar** · 12-31-08, 04:06 PM

Where I used to work, there were five officers who were Muslim. They petitioned the brass and received permission to use an empty windowless office next to the restroom to do their prayers in. They had prayer rugs on the ground, and we were not allowed to go in that room unless we were Muslim. They would go to the station several times during the shift and wash their head, hands, and feet, then go pray in the office they were given. Every time they went to go pray they would advise the dispatcher they would be off-air at the station for a few minutes, and the rest of us would have to pick up the slack in the meantime.

You know, it was a terrible inconvenience at times, but I never complained about that when I worked there, it didn't bother me, as it was their religion, and I made efforts to accept it, as they made efforts to accept that we said a prayer of safekeeping at roll call, and during lunch.

Maybe I should have sued. Apparently modern interpretation of religious freedom is the belief that no one is allowed to express religion except in private where it doesn't effect the religious beliefs of others...

**Morris** · 01-01-09, 12:31 AM

Bullshit. If your religion interferes with you doing your paid job, go do something else. I'd be suing the department for endangering officers or special treatment. With that kind of nonsense, I could demand a special room with an alter to summon the Kindreds. Or for my practicing Jewish friends, wear a yarmulke all day.

We are staggering to failure as a nation.