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  1. #1
    k-9max's Avatar
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    Wash. state woman 1st death under new suicide law!

    Linda Fleming was diagnosed with terminal cancer and feared her last days would be filled with pain and ever-stronger doses of medication that would erode her mind.
    The 66-year-old woman with late-stage pancreatic cancer wanted to be clear-headed at death, so she became the first person to kill herself under Washington state's new assisted suicide law, known as "death with dignity."
    "I am a very spiritual person, and it was very important to me to be conscious, clear-minded and alert at the time of my death," Fleming said in a statement released Friday. "The powerful pain medications were making it difficult to maintain the state of mind I wanted to have at my death. And I knew I would have to increase them."

    With family members, her physician and her dog at her side, Fleming took a deadly dose of prescription barbiturates and died Thursday night at her home in Sequim, Wash.
    Chris Carlson, who campaigned against the new law with the Coalition Against Assisted Suicide, called the death unfortunate.
    "Any premature death is a sad occasion and it diminishes us all," he said.
    Compassion & Choices of Washington, an advocacy group that aids people who seek to use the law, announced her death.
    Last November, Washington became the second state to have a voter-approved assisted suicide law. It is based on a law adopted by Oregon voters in 1997. Since then, about 400 people have used the Oregon law to end their lives.
    In December, a district judge in Montana ruled that doctor-assisted suicides are legal in that state. That decision, based on an individual lawsuit rather than a state law or voter initiative, is before the Montana Supreme Court.
    Doctors in Montana are allowed to write prescriptions for life-ending drugs pending the appeal. But it's unknown whether any actually have because there's no reporting process in place.
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  2. #2
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    Paging Dr. Jack Kevorkian, stat!


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  3. #3
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    I wonder if they have to go through any sort of psychological screening, or have a specific medical background?


    That's interesting....I don't see why not. If you wanna die you should be able to die, preferably with medications in a clean, respectable setting; rather than with a .357 painting your bedroom wall red.
    No one has greater love than this, to lay down ones life for ones friends - John 15:13

    "The Wicked Flee When No Man Pursueth: But The Righteous Are Bold As A Lion".

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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmur5074 View Post
    I wonder if they have to go through any sort of psychological screening, or have a specific medical background?


    That's interesting....I don't see why not. If you wanna die you should be able to die, preferably with medications in a clean, respectable setting; rather than with a .357 painting your bedroom wall red.
    +1
    YEAH, IM THE BERRIES, AND CHERRIES IN YOUR REAR VIEW MIRROR.

    Handle every stressful situation like a dog.
    Eat it, Play with it, or piss on it, and walk away!

    As smart as man is, we haven't been able to invent a machine that can smell drugs or tell us where a person has walked, Dogs are sophisticated investigative tools!

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmur5074 View Post


    That's interesting....I don't see why not. If you wanna die you should be able to die, preferably with medications in a clean, respectable setting; rather than with a .357 painting your bedroom wall red.
    Kind of like this scene from "Soylent Green?"





  6. #6
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    Although I am sure for some the religious aspect of this would make this off putting but for some I think it would be the greatest gift you could give someone rather than watch them die in pain for an extended period of time knowing there is nothing you can do.
    Never be afraid to do what's right, especially if the well-being of a person or animal is at stake. Society's punishments are small compared to the wounds we inflict on our soul when we look the other way" ~Martin Luther King, Jr

  7. #7
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    I am not sure there is any "good" way to die when you have a terminal illness or are so berift of hope that death is the only option.

    I AM sure that with each such new law or practice, we take another step toward giving others the power of life and death over us.

    Would you trust a doctor who will help you die? Is that what doctors and our government is supposed to do for it's citizens?

    If you are going to drink the cool aid, please do so with your eyes wide open....it isn't just you who may be affected but your children and grandchildren...are you giving up their right to life?


    Car 4
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Car 4 View Post
    I am not sure there is any "good" way to die when you have a terminal illness or are so berift of hope that death is the only option.

    I AM sure that with each such new law or practice, we take another step toward giving others the power of life and death over us.

    Would you trust a doctor who will help you die? Is that what doctors and our government is supposed to do for it's citizens?

    If you are going to drink the cool aid, please do so with your eyes wide open....it isn't just you who may be affected but your children and grandchildren...are you giving up their right to life?


    Car 4

    This has been my thought also. Its only a thin line at that point to start euthenizing people when it may cost more to heal them then they will contribute to society. Or based on religious/political/racial beliefs. Its a slippery slope
    'Political Correctness is a doctrine fostered by a
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    holds forth the proposition that it is entirely
    possible to pick up a turd by the clean end!'

    A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity. Sigmund Freud

  9. #9
    Wolven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pgg View Post
    This has been my thought also. Its only a thin line at that point to start euthenizing people when it may cost more to heal them then they will contribute to society. Or based on religious/political/racial beliefs. Its a slippery slope
    I actually completely agree with both you and Car4. Anytime we give humans something like this where the risk/potential for abuse is high, it is in all actually probably NOT a good idea. The idea behind it though is a good one in my opinion.
    Never be afraid to do what's right, especially if the well-being of a person or animal is at stake. Society's punishments are small compared to the wounds we inflict on our soul when we look the other way" ~Martin Luther King, Jr

  10. #10
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    I'm not convinced a doctor needs to be involved in a process you can solve with a .45.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by maclean View Post
    I'm not convinced a doctor needs to be involved in a process you can solve with a .45.
    But what if one wants to kill oneself but is scared of guns and doesn't own a gun? Or if one does manage to acquire a gun, but one's aim is bad and one not only fails to kill oneself but ends up being forced to live under medical supervision (which would prevent further suicide attempts) with half of one's face blown off, thus compounding the suffering that originally made one decide that life isn't worth living?

    If I ever am in a situation where I've rationally decided that suicide is the least worst option, I'd much prefer to be able to do it legally, with a doctor there to ensure that I really do end up dead rather than just severely disabled, with the ability to say goodbye to friends and family members without fear of implicating them in my "murder", and with the ability to avoid traumatizing the LEOs who would eventually discover my body if my fear of implicating anyone else caused me to kill myself alone without telling anyone in advance. If euthanasia is legal I'd also be more likely to wait and see if my suffering is bad enough to warrant suicide, rather than trying to do it before I end up disabled enough to need medical supervision that would prevent future suicide attempts.

  12. #12
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    I think that having the choice of being able to die with dignity, instead of after months of tubes and morphine hazes and not even being able to take care of your own bodily functions, would be a gift. I've watched two people whom I love dearly suffer in ways that no one should ever have to, in ways that I wouldn't allow a pet to suffer, and I knew that it was only going to get worse. Sometimes death is a release, and when the person suffering like that can make the choice to not be in unending pain anymore, it's a good thing. This isn't something that can be done by someone on the spur of the moment, there's a rather lengthy process to go through before it's approved, as well as multiple doctor evaluations, paperwork, written appeals, etc. We're not talking healthy people taking this route, we're talking people who at best would have a few months to live, and those months would be agony beyond which anyone should be made to endure. There would be no 'getting better' for this group, just days and nights blurred together by pain and narcotic sleep, for months on end. That's not life. That's hell. And it's the person's own choice to end that hell for themselves.
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  13. #13
    Morris is offline Chief Wheaties Pisser
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    When you hold a loved one who dies in your arms after suffering incalculable pain from a terminal illness (in my case, cancer), you begin to see the value in one having the free will and RIGHT to terminate one's life. Washington state is one of the better laws on the books.

  14. #14
    MacLean's Avatar
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    No argument with the right to die - I simply think doctors should stay on the healing side of the line.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  15. #15
    Morris is offline Chief Wheaties Pisser
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    So long as the idiots in the DEA and FDA control the drugs necessary to end one's life, doctors will have to be in the mix.

  16. #16
    MacLean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morris View Post
    So long as the idiots in the DEA and FDA control the drugs necessary to end one's life, doctors will have to be in the mix.
    I'm all for figuring out another way - a hospice industry perhaps.
    I'm your huckleberry...

    Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentus telum est!

    You can be the weapon, and the gun in your hand is a tool - or the gun is a weapon and you are the tool.


    I was looking for a saint who was a devil of a lover,
    but every girl I found was either one way or the other...



  17. #17
    pgg's Avatar
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    They could go to their local neighborhood unlisenced pharmacist at the street corner.
    'Political Correctness is a doctrine fostered by a
    delusional, illogical liberal minority, and rabidly
    promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which
    holds forth the proposition that it is entirely
    possible to pick up a turd by the clean end!'

    A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity. Sigmund Freud

 

 

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