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  1. #1
    Pedro56's Avatar
    Pedro56 is offline Englewood Ranger/Infidel Extraordinaire
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    Man critical from 'non-lethal' weapon

    By Dan Ponce



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    September 19, 2006 - A northwest suburban man is in critical condition after being shot by police with a beanbag weapon. Authorities in McHenry County say the man was shot after he charged at officers with a knife. Relatives of the man claim excessive force was used.

    This is the first time the sheriff's deputies have used a bean bag shotgun. It is a regular shotgun that is armed with small bean bags instead of shells. It is supposed to be a non-lethal option. But a man is fighting for his life and his friends and family are demanding answers. "He was the most compassionate, giving, caring, loving, sensitive human being I've ever met in my life, would never harm anybody. He had an illness," said Patsy Ercoli, David Maxson's fiance.

    Patsy called 911 late Saturday after her fiance, 43-year-old David Maxson, threatened to kill himself. He is suffering from depression and mental illness. When police arrived at the home in Wonder Lake, they found him in the living room with a knife. They say he threatened officers and threatened to take his own life.

    After the police tried to negotiate, Maxson lunged after a sheriff's deputy with a knife. The deputy then shot him three times with the weapon armed with bean bags, considered a non-lethal option. He was hit twice in the chest and once in the head.

    "There was no need for him to shoot him in the head and the chest point blank. They literally crushed his skull," said Ercoli.

    Ercoli says police didn't need to shoot him with bean bags. She says at 5-foot-3, 115 pounds, he is small enough for officers to subdue. Though she wasn't in the room at the time of the incident, she says there is no way Maxson was threatening anyone's life but his own and she refuses to believe police.

    "They can lie, change the story. I know the truth. God knows the truth and they're going to have to live with it," Ercoli said.

    "No matter how we look at the situation, it's a tragedy. But I have to view this from what facts are presented to us at this time," said Gene Lowery, McHenry County undersheriff.

    Lowery says, according to reports, it appears the sheriff's deputy who fired the shotgun followed proper procedure.

    "What we're talking about now over a lengthy period of time he had to decide within a matter of seconds. I think, preliminarily, it will show that he made the right decision," said Lowery.

    The investigation is being conducted by Illinois State Police.

    Meanwhile, David Maxson remains in critical condition at Northern Illinois Medical Center.
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  2. #2
    Pedro56's Avatar
    Pedro56 is offline Englewood Ranger/Infidel Extraordinaire
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    Umm, if I read this correctly didn't Mickey the Knife Weilding Mope charge officers with a knife? I think I would have emptied my .45 into him. Just my opinion though.
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    "I am the guy that keeps Mister Dead in his pocket." -'Mad' Max Rockatansky

    "An Englewood Ranger is no stranger to Danger.." -Unk

    Good Night Chesty Where Ever You Are.

    A Good Friend will bail you out of jail, but a true friend will be sitting next to you in the cell saying, "That was Awesome."

    God Made Police Men so Fireman Would Have Heroes.

  3. #3
    conalabu is offline Grasshopper
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    Lethal force. I wouldn't have even had the taser out for this guy.
    And Shepards we shall be,
    for thee, My Lord, for thee,
    Power hath descended forth from Thy hand,
    That our feet may swiftly carry out Thy Command.
    So we shall flow a river forth to Thee
    And teeming with souls will it ever be.
    In Nomine Patris, Et Filli, Et Spiritus Sancti.

  4. #4
    Norm357's Avatar
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    Sux to be that guy. Maybe he learned his lesson?
    dlefdal said:
    Ummmm, what if I don't like thumbs in my butt?

  5. #5
    Norm357's Avatar
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    Ercoli says police didn't need to shoot him with bean bags. She says at 5-foot-3, 115 pounds, he is small enough for officers to subdue. Though she wasn't in the room at the time of the incident, she says there is no way Maxson was threatening anyone's life but his own and she refuses to believe police.

    "They can lie, change the story. I know the truth. God knows the truth and they're going to have to live with it," Ercoli said.
    Oh yeah. This person is an idiot.
    dlefdal said:
    Ummmm, what if I don't like thumbs in my butt?

  6. #6
    Hannibal's Avatar
    Hannibal is offline Zombie Killin' Sheepdog
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    the man was shot...
    (less-lethal munitions)
    ... after he charged at officers with a knife. Relatives of the man claim excessive force was used.

    He is lucky if you ask me. If it had been me he charged with a knife he would find himself weighing a few hundred grains heavier.

    "Stupid should hurt."

  7. #7
    Standard Dave's Avatar
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    He had a knife and was threatening to kill himself, what did the family expect when they called the cops for them to ask nicely if he would mind sitting in the back of a cruiser.

    I don't care how small someone is if they have a lethal weapon they could take out anyone.

    People would complain if they had sprayed him and ragged him around the street trying to disarm him and cuff him.

    Lose-Lose situation.

  8. #8
    jmur5074's Avatar
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    Well, I think everyone here shares the same sentiment....
    No one has greater love than this, to lay down ones life for ones friends - John 15:13

    "The Wicked Flee When No Man Pursueth: But The Righteous Are Bold As A Lion".

    We lucky few, we band of brothers. For he who today sheds his blood with me shall be my brother.

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    The opinions, beliefs, and ideas expressed in this post are mine, and mine alone. They are NOT the opinions, beliefs, ideas, or policies of my Agency, Police Chief, City Council, or any member of my department.

  9. #9
    Willowdared's Avatar
    Willowdared is offline Bendy not Breaky
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    How weird....we had a similar incident here on Sunday....suicidal male threatened deputies with a knife.....they used lethal.
    Molly Weasley makes Chuck Norris eat his vegetables.

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  10. #10
    ghost98 is offline BEEN THERE BUT NOT EVERYWHERE
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    Everyone you're reading it all wrong the Police should have said "PLEASE DROP THE KNIFE" ..... Then everything would have been ok........(not)

  11. #11
    slamdunc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro56 View Post
    Relatives of the man claim excessive force was used.
    This guy was using deadly force, and these officers used a level below that in the force continuum.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro56 View Post
    Patsy called 911 late Saturday after her fiance, 43-year-old David Maxson, threatened to kill himself. He is suffering from depression and mental illness. When police arrived at the home in Wonder Lake, they found him in the living room with a knife. They say he threatened officers and threatened to take his own life.
    Suicide by Cop anyone?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro56 View Post
    After the police tried to negotiate, Maxson lunged after a sheriff's deputy with a knife. The deputy then shot him three times with the weapon armed with bean bags, considered a non-lethal option. He was hit twice in the chest and once in the head.
    Excellent shot placement; just like they showed us in the academy.


    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro56 View Post
    The investigation is being conducted by Illinois State Police.
    This could be a problem. If these deputies were not wearing their seatbelts while en route to the call, they're gonna' fry them.
    'The Art of War' teaches us to "Rely not on the likelihood of the enemy's coming, but on our own readiness to receive him"--Sun Tsu

  12. #12
    Willowdared's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ghost98 View Post
    Everyone you're reading it all wrong the Police should have said "PLEASE DROP THE KNIFE" ..... Then everything would have been ok........(not)
    No, when he threatened to kill himself, they should have said "go for it dude," - oh wait, that's not PC is it?
    Molly Weasley makes Chuck Norris eat his vegetables.

    Do not puff, shade, skew, tailor, firm up, stretch, massage,
    or otherwise distort statements of fact.
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  13. #13
    Hannibal's Avatar
    Hannibal is offline Zombie Killin' Sheepdog
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    Quote Originally Posted by slamdunc View Post
    This could be a problem. If these deputies were not wearing their seatbelts while en route to the call, they're gonna' fry them.

    "Stupid should hurt."

  14. #14
    TheOldRhino's Avatar
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    I hate the term "non-lethal". I hate it. No such animal. It's less-lethal. Anyone who says non-letha needs to be shot in the face.
    The virtue of spirit has no need for thanks or approval. Only the certain conviction that what has been done is right. -Jor El, as played by Marlon Brando

  15. #15
    121Traffic's Avatar
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    It sounds as if the deputy reacted perfectly to the threat. The beanbag should be aimed an deployed a meatier areas like the pelvic girdle when it is used as a less-lethal option. BUT, if the situation escalates in a heartbeat to a deadly force encounter, we were trained to fire REPEATEDLY at the "red zones", i.e. the chest and the head as those areas are considered "deadly" targets. Deadly force was met with deadly force here.
    "If anything worthwhile comes of this tragedy, it should be the realization by every citizen that often the only thing that stands between them and losing everything they hold dear... is the man wearing a badge." -- Ronald Reagan, in the wake of the deaths of 4 CHP troopers in the Newhall Incident, 1970

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  16. #16
    adroitcuffs's Avatar
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    "He was the most compassionate, giving, caring, loving, sensitive human being I've ever met in my life, would never harm anybody. He had an illness," said Patsy Ercoli, David Maxson's fiance.


    Hmmmm, perhaps we are confused... he's such a giving man that maybe he wasn't actually "charging" the officers with the knife, he was so grateful to see the officers that he was rushing to hand them the knife....
    The true measure of your character is what you choose to do when you think no one is looking.

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  17. #17
    TheOldRhino's Avatar
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    That's the thing about officer-shootings (no matter what they shoot). We see the dirtbag POS waste of human skin threatening our life or the lives of the people we're sworn to protect.

    But somewhere between the street and the newspaper the next day they become the next candidate for the Nobel Peace Prize.

    Funny how that works out, ain't it?
    The virtue of spirit has no need for thanks or approval. Only the certain conviction that what has been done is right. -Jor El, as played by Marlon Brando

  18. #18
    slamdunc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adroitcuffs View Post
    [I]Hmmmm, perhaps we are confused... he's such a giving man that maybe he wasn't actually "charging" the officers with the knife, he was so grateful to see the officers that he was rushing to hand them the knife....
    Or perhaps to share in a 'Group Hug'.
    The cowardly pin-head just couldn't off himself, so he thought he'd screw up some poor cops life and make him do it.
    'The Art of War' teaches us to "Rely not on the likelihood of the enemy's coming, but on our own readiness to receive him"--Sun Tsu

  19. #19
    Pedro56's Avatar
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    Funny you say these things, I got in a little trouble once. We got a call of an attempt suicide and when I spoke to the caller I told him if you really want to do it then do it, why are you calling me to tell me that you are thinking about it? I got nailed for it.
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  20. #20
    slamdunc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro56 View Post
    Funny you say these things, I got in a little trouble once. We got a call of an attempt suicide and when I spoke to the caller I told him if you really want to do it then do it, why are you calling me to tell me that you are thinking about it? I got nailed for it.
    I think it out on the street, and only say it here. One of my partners actually told a suicidal subject to "call after you finish next time". If that guy would have complained, it would have been bad.
    'The Art of War' teaches us to "Rely not on the likelihood of the enemy's coming, but on our own readiness to receive him"--Sun Tsu

 

 
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